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LibreOffice blogs about Blockchain, locks comments after negative user feedback

blog.documentfoundation.org

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Re: LibreOffice blogs about Blockchain, locks comments after negative user feedback

#51

Post by MarkPNeyer »

manholio wrote: post #25
Brian_K_White wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You just exemplified their point. original post: we're not talking about crypto comment: they're not talking about crypto but people still just say "F them crypto is bad!" this comment: F them because crypto is bad! Crypto (money, nfts) is bad, I think smart contracts are a mistake too, and I don't think LO needs blockchain either, but the objection is more like the one someone else said about, if there's some featur…

The only revolutionary thing blockchains enable is decentralized electronic cash and financial assets, which are fundamentally bad ideas, and the reaction is justified. Any other "blockchain" related innovation is just a solution in search of a problem with the real purpose of pumping some virtual asset and selling it off in volume to other speculators. Anything you claim can be done with blockchains (other than dece…

This is a first world perspective.

You clearly live with a political stable government you can trust not to steal from you or imprison you for engaging in political protests.

People in such places are using decentralized assets to protect themselves. What do you think they should do instead?

Re: LibreOffice blogs about Blockchain, locks comments after negative user feedback

#52

Post by xigoi »

web3isgoing wrote: post #18

You would think a message board called "hacker news" would be more open to blue sky thinking. Zero knowledge proofs and a tamper proof ledger of timestamped cryptographic signatures could open up new use cases that are different than relying on central authorities. One idea, document signing: vitalik.eth signs a PDF, everybody can verify the PDF is signed by his private key. He has to broadcast his public key for thi…

> Another alternative is these messages are broadcast through a public and decentralized ledger

Or, you know, the author's website?

Re: LibreOffice blogs about Blockchain, locks comments after negative user feedback

#53

Post by joao_lopes »

dhdgrygev wrote: post #19
Brian_K_White wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You just exemplified their point. original post: we're not talking about crypto comment: they're not talking about crypto but people still just say "F them crypto is bad!" this comment: F them because crypto is bad! Crypto (money, nfts) is bad, I think smart contracts are a mistake too, and I don't think LO needs blockchain either, but the objection is more like the one someone else said about, if there's some featur…

There are no real world use cases of blockchain tech besides crypto. Or can you demonstrate one?

Academia is currently exploring multiple use cases, and some are already being used in real world scenarios. Permissioned blockchains for example can have multiple use cases in enterprise.

An example is supply chain management [0] and supply chain traceability, which is already in use at Walmart [1].

[0] https://scholar.google.pt/scholar?q=blockchain+supply+chain+... [1] https://jbba.scholasticahq.com/article/3712.pdf

Re: LibreOffice blogs about Blockchain, locks comments after negative user feedback

#54

Post by SCdF »

web3isgoing wrote: post #18

You would think a message board called "hacker news" would be more open to blue sky thinking. Zero knowledge proofs and a tamper proof ledger of timestamped cryptographic signatures could open up new use cases that are different than relying on central authorities. One idea, document signing: vitalik.eth signs a PDF, everybody can verify the PDF is signed by his private key. He has to broadcast his public key for thi…

idk man, I was open minded on cryptocurrency backed blockchains for a decade, I'm kind of over it now.

Everything you're describing could be done with a git repo (also a cryptographically signed tamperproof ledger), 10x faster and with 1000x less baggage of a deeply scummy industry behind it.

The core problem to solve with your idea is proving that a piece of data that represents someone electronically (eg a public key) truly actually represents them physically. Cryptocurrency backed blockchain solves none of this any more than any other technological solution does, because it does nothing to tackle the actually hard problem, of making that physical->electronic link.

Keybase did it by not truly doing it, and instead providing a plethora of different ways that all somewhat do it, and left it up to the user as to whether they trusted that. So you can link your domain, your twitter, your reddit, your crypto wallet, etc. That still didn't actually prove the physical->electronic link, but it added evidence.

Re: LibreOffice blogs about Blockchain, locks comments after negative user feedback

#55

Post by soco »

azangru wrote: post #36
h4kor wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because there are no use cases for blockchains. Humanity spent billions (trillions?) of $ on this technology and there is no use for it. Now the people who sank their money into this, desperately try to find some fools to pass the hot potato to.

> Because there are no use cases for blockchains. Someone in the comments on LibreOffice blog expressed the same opinion. Which surprised me. Has the consensus been reached among the serious non-grifting public that blockchains are useless to represent peer-to-peer trustless money? Has bitcoin been declared a failure?

I'm not sure how a word processor uses peer-to-peer trustless money. The discussion shouldn't even be about crypto and blockchains, but about how crypto and blockchain can benefit LibreOffice. Given we cannot identify how crypto and blockchain can benefit anybody (well, except scammers and those 11 folks who actually transferred assets to third world countries) I believe the topic should have quickly died off but yeah...

Re: LibreOffice blogs about Blockchain, locks comments after negative user feedback

#56

Post by xigoi »

fsflover wrote: post #48
xigoi wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bitcoin is wasting humongous amounts of energy during a climate and energy crisis, which makes it morally unacceptable.

Banks also require a lot of energy.

Not nearly as much.

Re: LibreOffice blogs about Blockchain, locks comments after negative user feedback

#57

Post by q-big »

web3isgoing wrote: post #18

You would think a message board called "hacker news" would be more open to blue sky thinking. Zero knowledge proofs and a tamper proof ledger of timestamped cryptographic signatures could open up new use cases that are different than relying on central authorities. One idea, document signing: vitalik.eth signs a PDF, everybody can verify the PDF is signed by his private key. He has to broadcast his public key for thi…

> You would think a message board called "hacker news" would be more open to blue sky thinking.

On the other hand: a site called "Hacker News" will likely point out business scams involving technology. ;-)

If you desire this openness towards blue sky thinking, we should unmask all those cryptocurrency con men so that the only people who stay in the cryptocurrency ecosystem are those who really are into the mathematics behind it or love blue sky thinking.

Re: LibreOffice blogs about Blockchain, locks comments after negative user feedback

#58

Post by nkrisc »

pyr0hu wrote: post #2

I don't know, talking about blockchain became such an extreme topic that one can't just talk about it, even if it's a note that "We had a chat with Eth Foundation" and people are coming with foaming mouth. The article does not mention that they are thinking about _crypto_ but _blockchain_, which, seems like not a lot of people know about, does not 100% means "im going to release a shitcoin, haha, rugpull". It's insan…

The post itself is bizarre. Imagine they had said: "we had a discussion with Denuvo about DRM (We’re not talking about putting DRM into LibreOffice!). In what ways could people find a combination of LibreOffice Technology and DRM be useful?"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denuvo

I'm not trying to equate blockchain and DRM. The big question lingering over their post is "why?"

From what I can see the essence of the reaction is towards the fact they appear to be in search of a problem for their shiny solution. Maybe they find a real problem, but usually you don't have your solution before you find it.

Re: LibreOffice blogs about Blockchain, locks comments after negative user feedback

#59

Post by miohtama »

piva00 wrote: post #32
web3isgoing wrote: post #18

You would think a message board called "hacker news" would be more open to blue sky thinking. Zero knowledge proofs and a tamper proof ledger of timestamped cryptographic signatures could open up new use cases that are different than relying on central authorities. One idea, document signing: vitalik.eth signs a PDF, everybody can verify the PDF is signed by his private key. He has to broadcast his public key for thi…

> You would think a message board called "hacker news" would be more open to blue sky thinking. And as you can see all over HN, most of us are quite tired of this diatribe... This appeal to HN requiring us to be open-minded about a technology that had more than a decade to prove itself in a real world application is tiresome. I mentioned in another comment just this week, I was really excited about Bitcoin in 2012 an…

It is incorrect to say nothing has happened during the last 10 years. Zero-knowledge proofs, as discussed in the potential research collaboration between Ethereum Foundation and LibreOffice, are more recent. The most useful, or compact, zero-knowledge proof systems have been created during the last few years. This can be partially contributed to the blockchain research.

You can more about the history of zero knowledge in this Wikipedia article:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zero-knowledge_proof#Zero-Know...

Re: LibreOffice blogs about Blockchain, locks comments after negative user feedback

#60

Post by pyr0hu »

sdiacom wrote: post #6
pyr0hu wrote: post #2

I don't know, talking about blockchain became such an extreme topic that one can't just talk about it, even if it's a note that "We had a chat with Eth Foundation" and people are coming with foaming mouth. The article does not mention that they are thinking about _crypto_ but _blockchain_, which, seems like not a lot of people know about, does not 100% means "im going to release a shitcoin, haha, rugpull". It's insan…

Good. The mere mention of "combining existing successful open-source product with blockchain" should get about the same reaction as "combining fruit bowls with metal spikes". This is a good thing, it means that people are waking up to what crypto actually is. There is no successful or interesting combination of "useful thing" and "blockchain", unless your definition of success is siphoning money from technologically…

But why can't we talk about it like normal people? Everyone is coming against each other, it became such a taboo that one can't have a normal conversation with an other person for like a minute before they start going against each other's throat. It's starting to become like talking about politics.
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