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FTX held less than $1B in liquid assets against $9B in liabilities

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Re: FTX held less than $1B in liquid assets against $9B in liabilities

#51
post #10

> In all, the spreadsheet says FTX Trading’s assets were $900mn of “liquid” assets, $5.5bn of “less liquid” assets consisting of crypto tokens Aren't tokens supposed to be "liquid" or is this a different way of saying the tokens are worthless?

tokens are as liquid as worthless currency of many dying countries out there. Who are the takers for these tokens? For instance, the whole world loves to swap their real assets (commodities, etc) with US dollars. How many want to part with their US dollars for these tokens? Hardly any. So, worthless.

Re: FTX held less than $1B in liquid assets against $9B in liabilities

#52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ethereum multi-sig wallets do the trust side fantastically side very well. In addition you get ways to handle lost keys, ownership changes, and the ability to require multiple people to sign off on any action.

What is an "Ethereum multi-sig wallet"? Is that a piece of hardware? Multiple pieces of hardware? A piece of software?

There's different ways to handle multi-sig, but https://gnosis-safe.io is probably the current gold standard, and it's pretty easy to set up and use.

It's a smart contract that you can add any type of owner to (regular wallet, hardware wallet, anything that can sign for transactions), then you specify how many of the owners need to sign for transactions.

Re: FTX held less than $1B in liquid assets against $9B in liabilities

#53
post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

FDIC insurance is backed by the full faith and credit of the government of the United States of America, and since its start in 1933 no depositor has ever lost a penny of FDIC-insured funds. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_Deposit_Insurance_Corp...

Many things happen that have not happened since 1933.

You know what also was backed by the full faith and credit of the government of the United States of America? That you can get the value of your dollar in gold. That "backing" was also in place for over a hundred years. Until the government decided to just say "Sorry, we decided otherwise. You cannot get your gold out anymore.".

Re: FTX held less than $1B in liquid assets against $9B in liabilities

#54

Is this normal? I would assume that no bank has 100% liquid assets against liabilities (same as stuffing all your money under your mattress.) So what is the "right" ratio for an exchange? Close to 100% since you are not supposed to invest an exchange's money?

>Is this normal? I would assume that no bank has 100% liquid assets against liabilities

Banks are required by law to have regulatory capital[1] and reserves[2] in order to stay liquid and solvent.

Longer explanation: "The reserves only provide liquidity to cover withdrawals within the normal pattern. Banks and the central bank expect that in normal circumstances only a proportion of deposits will be withdrawn at the same time, and that the reserves will be sufficient to meet the demand for cash. However, banks routinely find themselves in a shortfall situation or may experience an unexpected bank run, when depositors wish to withdraw more funds than the reserves held by the bank. In that event, the bank experiencing the liquidity shortfall may routinely borrow short-term funds in the interbank lending market from banks with a surplus. In exceptional situations, the central bank may provide funds to cover the short-term shortfall as lender of last resort. When the bank liquidity problem exceeds the central bank’s lender of last resort resources, as happened during the global financial crisis of 2007-2008, the government may try to restore confidence in the banking system, for example, by providing government guarantees[2]."

If commercial bank is in trouble other commercial banks will try to help but if they can not help, central bank will try to help and if that is not possible government will step in.

All in all, banking industry is tightly regulated and somewhat safe especially after 2007 fiasco.

In the case of FTX, Binance said they would step in but they gave up. If FTX is profitable they can gradually loan money from private sector(banks, investment funds etc.) then start to repay their liabilities and eventually return loans.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capital_requirement

[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reserve_requirement

Re: FTX held less than $1B in liquid assets against $9B in liabilities

#55

10% liquid doesn't necessarily concern me when considering a bank. But, they have many more routes to liquidity than FTX (Liam from the fed, loans from other banks, etc.). And even still, 10% isn't legal for a bank if their liquid assets are too volatile. 450 mil was in SBFs Robinhood investment, and FTX clearly didn't have any other avenues towards liquidity. 10% without an out was a predictably bad idea

FTX isn’t a bank. They aren’t supposed to operate as a fractional reserve. Coinbase would be crucified by the SEC if they did this.

Seems like they were offering leverage, which plenty financial businesses besides banks do (such as brokers) and has the same effect.

Re: FTX held less than $1B in liquid assets against $9B in liabilities

#56

Is this normal? I would assume that no bank has 100% liquid assets against liabilities (same as stuffing all your money under your mattress.) So what is the "right" ratio for an exchange? Close to 100% since you are not supposed to invest an exchange's money?

I think with cryptocurrencies we need to consider the sheer speed at which mass transactions can occur, and 24/7 to boot.

Technically, the problem you're restricting to cryptocurrencies is actually something finance as a whole just deal with.

Everyone could withdraw all their money at the same time. What happens then? The answer is bank run. There will literally not be enough cash to do it. The entire system is running on the fact that everyone has not done that yet.

Personally, I want to have it happen, just to force the system to come to terms with the fact that it isn't all just about numbers, and so that people can actually materially witness the sheer magnitude of monetary centralization created by our system.

Fuck the inconvenience. If Mammon is going to fucking rule, let everyone see it's rictus. Let everyone take in what it looks like.

Re: FTX held less than $1B in liquid assets against $9B in liabilities

#57

There should be more discussion about how to store value without counterparty risk. Most people think it is as easy as ordering a hardware wallet, following the process the wallet software suggests and - hurray! - your keys, your coins! But it is not that easy. You also have to cut the wallet manufacturer and the software developer out of the loop. I have yet to see a description on how to safely create a wallet that…

> There should be more discussion about how to store value without counterparty risk. > Most people think it is as easy as ordering a hardware wallet, following the process the wallet software suggests and - hurray! - your keys, your coins! What exactly is the threat model here? To my knowledge, there's been no general compromise of truly air-gapped hardware that could only exfiltrate data by a back channel in an oth…

Not targeted. The typical way of handling bitcoin is flawed in multiple ways.

Lets look at the simplest way a hardware manufacturer could get your private key: They make the hardware wallet create the private key in a way the manufacturer can guess.

But there are more elaborate ones. For another one, take a look at this discussion:

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32181462

Re: FTX held less than $1B in liquid assets against $9B in liabilities

#58
post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FDIC insurance is backed by the full faith and credit of the government of the United States of America, and since its start in 1933 no depositor has ever lost a penny of FDIC-insured funds. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_Deposit_Insurance_Corp...

Many things happen that have not happened since 1933. You know what also was backed by the full faith and credit of the government of the United States of America? That you can get the value of your dollar in gold. That "backing" was also in place for over a hundred years. Until the government decided to just say "Sorry, we decided otherwise. You cannot get your gold out anymore.".

What is the purpose of gold? It is a shiny metal with some nice electric properties. Exactly like platinum, copper or whatever else.

The inherent "value" of it outside it's physical properties is as much of a human construct based on trust as the dollar.

Re: FTX held less than $1B in liquid assets against $9B in liabilities

#59
post #20

Kraken's proof-of-reserves audits are looking more and more attractive and important these days! https://blog.kraken.com/post/15002/kraken-proof-of-reserves-...

while kraken is one of the more reputable cex, at least from what ogs say, not your keys not your coins

the point of crypto is the ability to self custody without intermediary and verify funds are sound on-chain

non-custodial defi solves many of these issues

Re: FTX held less than $1B in liquid assets against $9B in liabilities

#60

There should be more discussion about how to store value without counterparty risk. Most people think it is as easy as ordering a hardware wallet, following the process the wallet software suggests and - hurray! - your keys, your coins! But it is not that easy. You also have to cut the wallet manufacturer and the software developer out of the loop. I have yet to see a description on how to safely create a wallet that…

what?

as always, the biggest risk to your cryptocurrency at an exchange is ... the exchange actively or passively stealing all your money. this has been the case for the entire history of cryptocurrency exchanges.

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