That might be true, but this is probably the beginning of sharply declining developer salaries. If you're going remote, a developer in California is going to be competing with devleopers in Kansas, not to mention overseas. The era of people fresh out of a developer bootcamp getting six figure salaries is all but done.
My company pays SF-payscale salaries no matter where the employee lives. That's how we attract and retain the best talent.
Remote startups will win the war for top talent
51–60 of 492 posts
Re: Remote startups will win the war for top talent
#52I never really understood why people say productivity and socializing is difficult remote. It's difficult because people aren't putting thought into it. At my last big-co job the leadership just kept waiting for 'covid to be over' and not improving our remote work culture. Hybrid models will always struggle and 1/3/1 is going to be probably the best you can do. My company is fully remote, we embraced the GitLab model…
We haven't tried hybrid but I don't really see the benefits of it. One big advantage of remote is being able to hire people in other locations. The only way I could see hybrid being useful would be to provide a work space for people who want to work away from home (i.e., for variety or because their house isn't conducive to it), and let those who prefer to work from home (i.e., parents with young kids who need a more flex schedule) do so without set office day requirements (or very few).
Re: Remote startups will win the war for top talent
#53I never really understood why people say productivity and socializing is difficult remote. It's difficult because people aren't putting thought into it. At my last big-co job the leadership just kept waiting for 'covid to be over' and not improving our remote work culture. Hybrid models will always struggle and 1/3/1 is going to be probably the best you can do. My company is fully remote, we embraced the GitLab model…
How do you handle taxes ?
For example in Europe a German company can't hire a French dev if the german company doesn't have a legal entity in France, it quickly gets out of control both in term of paperwork and cost. The dev can't be a freelancer because a freelancer with a full time, fixed hours, single customer is illegal in many places
Also let's say you have an American company with 200 german employees but no office on german soil, does that mean they don't pay any local tax because technically they don't operate their business in the country ?
I feel like a lot of loopholes which were seldom used will promptly be closed once they become widely used
Re: Remote startups will win the war for top talent
#54That might be true, but this is probably the beginning of sharply declining developer salaries. If you're going remote, a developer in California is going to be competing with devleopers in Kansas, not to mention overseas. The era of people fresh out of a developer bootcamp getting six figure salaries is all but done.
That might well be true for FAANG-sized companies. Those businesses will pay start to pay less if they start embracing remote working (although right now they seem to be pushing for people to return to the office). It is not true for the rest of the IT world though. When developers can get remote jobs they're free to work for the highest paying company rather than whatever local IT industry there is. That pushes wages up if you're in Bumsville Idaho. Not to six-figures-for-a-junior levels, sure, but far more than you could earn before.
Overall I strongly suspect remote work will lead to developers earning more over the whole industry even if peak Bay Area wages drop a lot. Sucks if you work in the Bay I guess, and it sucks even more if you're a Bay Area landlord, but for the rest of us it's going to be awesome.
Re: Remote startups will win the war for top talent
#55- Young workers typically want to socialize with other young workers
- Older workers prefer to be alone, with family, etc. Have funds for larger homes and at-home amenities
- Nearly everyone hates commutes
- Cities are expensive and small, but exciting. Rural is large, open, inexpensive, but can be socially boring
- Office REITs want a return to the office because that's how they make their income
- Cities want a return to the office to support their tax base and economies
- Offices and cities are a huge tax on companies
- Some managers like to manage in person
- Extroverted roles may tend to prefer in person
- Physical work (hardware), whiteboarding, etc. are harder to do remotely. (Or impossible. You can't passage cell cultures remotely.)
- Much of the time spent in the office is wasted / distracting
- Remote work allows greater flexibility of running errands, doing chores, multi-tasking, childcare, ...
- Workers will tend to choose remote work over onsite work if the pay is the same
- It's expensive to live and work in California, not so much in middle America
- The pool of talent stretches far beyond America. Fungible remote workers means you can pay $50k for someone in another country to do the job of a $300k+ FAANG worker.
From a purely economic perspective, it seems like remote work will win out. But that entails drastic and cascading changes to everything. Labor will move beyond expensive American borders and become much cheaper for companies to hire and replace.
Re: Remote startups will win the war for top talent
#56That might be true, but this is probably the beginning of sharply declining developer salaries. If you're going remote, a developer in California is going to be competing with devleopers in Kansas, not to mention overseas. The era of people fresh out of a developer bootcamp getting six figure salaries is all but done.
My company pays SF-payscale salaries no matter where the employee lives. That's how we attract and retain the best talent.
Re: Remote startups will win the war for top talent
#57I never really understood why people say productivity and socializing is difficult remote. It's difficult because people aren't putting thought into it. At my last big-co job the leadership just kept waiting for 'covid to be over' and not improving our remote work culture. Hybrid models will always struggle and 1/3/1 is going to be probably the best you can do. My company is fully remote, we embraced the GitLab model…
Re: Remote startups will win the war for top talent
#58Okay, how about a tad more nuance though. The better headline would be "Remote Startups will win the war for top talent among employees who prefer to work remotely" Not quite so sexy. Sure some; probably even most software devs prefer remote/hybrid work, but there are still plenty of incredibly talented people out there who prefer being in the office every day.
I worked for 2 years in Silicon Valley with a WFH policy that I used maybe 2 days total (once for a package and the other for apartment maintenance). If you live close to work commuting isn't so bad. I need physical space in my life. Ideally every day of the week would have a commute to a different location.
This, I work from home when the weather is bad, otherwise it's a 10 minute bike ride, which is actually quite enjoyable when the weather is good and a nice way to compartmentalise the day (+ using my legs isn't a bad thing either)
Re: Remote startups will win the war for top talent
#59I never really understood why people say productivity and socializing is difficult remote. It's difficult because people aren't putting thought into it. At my last big-co job the leadership just kept waiting for 'covid to be over' and not improving our remote work culture. Hybrid models will always struggle and 1/3/1 is going to be probably the best you can do. My company is fully remote, we embraced the GitLab model…
Re: Remote startups will win the war for top talent
#60I never really understood why people say productivity and socializing is difficult remote. It's difficult because people aren't putting thought into it. At my last big-co job the leadership just kept waiting for 'covid to be over' and not improving our remote work culture. Hybrid models will always struggle and 1/3/1 is going to be probably the best you can do. My company is fully remote, we embraced the GitLab model…
> Meanwhile we have had no problem sourcing candidates since we can pull from anywhere in the world, we have some incredible people all over the world that we would not have gotten otherwise. How do you handle taxes ? For example in Europe a German company can't hire a French dev if the german company doesn't have a legal entity in France, it quickly gets out of control both in term of paperwork and cost. The dev can…
Essentially they have companies in most countries and you pay them (deel) directly and then they payout to your staff. This also simplifies benefits for healthcare, taxes, retirement.
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