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Game Design Mimetics (Or, What Happened to Game Design?)

blog.kylekukshtel.com

51–60 of 82 posts

Re: Game Design Mimetics (Or, What Happened to Game Design?)

#51
What I'm tired of is articles like these that try to make out the video game development past as some artistic endeavor, when it was almost entirely geeks fucking around with things they found fun. There is far more "art" in games these days, which I think is cool. We have a lot more innovation and design exploration, it's just that the major categories have been explored heavily. Plus people that want innovation have developed very niche tastes which means to mean that niche you have like a few hundred people as a market.

Additionally, this "what happened to game design" is a refrain I've literally heard every year for 30+ years now. Here's the thing: if you have fun with a game, most of the time you want to keep playing that game. I just finished Mad Max (late to it!) and it was awesome, and I want to just keep playing it, but there is nothing else in there except finding the few % of places that I didn't completely explore before. But I'd kill to have a DLC for it or a Mad Max 2 that is just more of the same.

There is far, far more exploration and experimentation now than ever, and if you think otherwise, you are looking at the past through rose tinted glasses.

Re: Game Design Mimetics (Or, What Happened to Game Design?)

#52

Sorry, I lost patience with the article and its premise about halfway through. Sure many AAA titles are cookie cutter and remakes now. I'd still claim that there hardly ever was a better time for video games. If you only focus on AAA that's your mistake. That said, Nintendo continues to produce innovative games. Breath of the Wild of course sticks out here. We continue to see other phenomenal games like Outer Wilds o…

> We continue to see other phenomenal games like Outer Wilds or Disco Elysium that push what a game can be and how closer to true art the medium has come. Since when is it about "true art" though ? It's not like arthouse cinema make record profits compared to mainstream movies... most humans don't like it and prefer the simple fun of mainstream media.

It's one of several innovative games I called out. It's significant since we likely couldn't have had something like this at this level of quality because it wouldn't have been economically viable. Planescape Torment is probably the closest we had gotten in the past and that didn't seem to be deemed a success by the publisher. While art house isn't mainstream there are still a lot of people who love it. I don't know exact numbers, but Disco Elysium won lots of awards and comes up in conversations online a lot.

Re: Game Design Mimetics (Or, What Happened to Game Design?)

#53

Sorry, I lost patience with the article and its premise about halfway through. Sure many AAA titles are cookie cutter and remakes now. I'd still claim that there hardly ever was a better time for video games. If you only focus on AAA that's your mistake. That said, Nintendo continues to produce innovative games. Breath of the Wild of course sticks out here. We continue to see other phenomenal games like Outer Wilds o…

Saying 'but there are some innovative indie games' is not a good approach to this problem. The talent pool is not unlimited and this AAA money factory kinds are suck up most of them, squeeze out most of the resources from the industry, deliver almost zero artistic value in return and makes these innovative titles the exception instead of the norm. They have been poisoning the industry for decades, but you say, it's a…

Sure, innovative titles might be the exception. There are so many games these days though that if I'm looking for something innovative as a consumer I can find lots of options.

Re: Game Design Mimetics (Or, What Happened to Game Design?)

#54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Farming Simulators Harvest Moon started that as far as I know, came out in 96/97, though it was more of an RPG with farming as the core gameplay loop rather than just a farming sim. [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harvest_Moon_(video_game)

I meant more the "simulator" games like Train Driver Simulator, Truck Driver Simulator, etc. that only really took off in the last decade (AFAIK). But certainly Harvest Moon has been a genre that's now entered the western mainstream much more, and took a while to 'take off' in the western markets with things like Stardew Valley and Animal Crossing in recent years.

The mundane simulator genre did exist in Germany way back in the 80s/90s, I remember a nice airline simulator I bought on a trip there (I'm from Sweden).

Re: Game Design Mimetics (Or, What Happened to Game Design?)

#55
Movie industry suffers the same but in a way worse way.

At least indie devs have a way to make a living, but indie moviemakers have a much harder time finding funds and studios are increasingly less prone to experimentation. Either it's a sequel, or some data-driven decision pushes the same variant of the same action/horror movie.

Re: Game Design Mimetics (Or, What Happened to Game Design?)

#56
post #21

My father (1951) went through Tandy's Dancing Demon through text adventure games, Lode Runner, Prince of Persia, Doom and modern video games. He went from black and white mummies movies through Rambo to Matrix. I (1980) was raised with Lucas Arts games, and you know the rest. The gap between my father and me is huge. He saw the entire entertaiment industry transforming, from technology and from content points of view…

I mean, you could say more or less the same about movies.

Early film (as soon as people realized that film != theatre, at least) was wildly experimental, because qualities of the medium were still largely unexplored. But after a while the rules became more and more codified, so that if you wanted to find something "new/more", you often had to look past the mainstream offering. Which, I mean, makes sense? As demand grows, a part of the industry will inevitably focus on the "tried and true" formulas. It allows them to play it safe and get more-or-less predictable returns on their investment.

(And about Ron/Monkey Island, actually he is being very clear he is not doing a retro game and he definitely wants to move the franchise forward. I surely hope so!)

Re: Game Design Mimetics (Or, What Happened to Game Design?)

#57

Sorry, I lost patience with the article and its premise about halfway through. Sure many AAA titles are cookie cutter and remakes now. I'd still claim that there hardly ever was a better time for video games. If you only focus on AAA that's your mistake. That said, Nintendo continues to produce innovative games. Breath of the Wild of course sticks out here. We continue to see other phenomenal games like Outer Wilds o…

The author is an indie game dev so I'm pretty sure they're aware of the segment and whilst it doesn't mention indie games until the footnotes I think he intends the critique to extend to that space as well. At least that was my reading of the whole thing from the perspective of being a game developer myself. Although I also know the broader context from the discussions on gamedev twitter over the past week or so. The…

> The author is an indie game dev

I wonder if this where the different perspective comes from. As a consumer I don't care very much if 95% of what the industry producers it's boring, not innovative or otherwise bad as long as there are enough games that fill my needs. Right now there is a unbelievable amount of games being released. As an adult with a job who has a variety of interests, I can't even play a fraction of the games I'm very interested in.

Re: Game Design Mimetics (Or, What Happened to Game Design?)

#59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The author is an indie game dev so I'm pretty sure they're aware of the segment and whilst it doesn't mention indie games until the footnotes I think he intends the critique to extend to that space as well. At least that was my reading of the whole thing from the perspective of being a game developer myself. Although I also know the broader context from the discussions on gamedev twitter over the past week or so. The…

> The author is an indie game dev I wonder if this where the different perspective comes from. As a consumer I don't care very much if 95% of what the industry producers it's boring, not innovative or otherwise bad as long as there are enough games that fill my needs. Right now there is a unbelievable amount of games being released. As an adult with a job who has a variety of interests, I can't even play a fraction o…

My ever growing Steam wishlist with titles under $20 agrees with you.

Re: Game Design Mimetics (Or, What Happened to Game Design?)

#60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Farming Simulators Harvest Moon started that as far as I know, came out in 96/97, though it was more of an RPG with farming as the core gameplay loop rather than just a farming sim. [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harvest_Moon_(video_game)

I meant more the "simulator" games like Train Driver Simulator, Truck Driver Simulator, etc. that only really took off in the last decade (AFAIK). But certainly Harvest Moon has been a genre that's now entered the western mainstream much more, and took a while to 'take off' in the western markets with things like Stardew Valley and Animal Crossing in recent years.

Fun fact about "Harvest Moon": the western publisher lost the contract to localize the original series, but still commissions new games under the same name. Remakes of the original series are localized by a different publisher under the name "Story of Seasons". It's a little bit like the Guitar Hero vs. Rock Band saga.
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