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Milk alternatives produce up to 4.5x less greenhouse gas emissions as milk

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Re: Milk alternatives produce up to 4.5x less greenhouse gas emissions as milk

#51

Post by CPLX »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #25
moralestapia wrote: post #9

That's nice but it's not milk so ... apples to oranges. I'm not being unreasonable here, some people just won't give up real meat or milk, ever.

There is a death spiral that can occur when demand for dairy milk declines below a level where the supply chain can no longer support itself economically. Milk consumption is down 40% from the 70s in the US, 2730 dairy farms went out of business between 2018 and 2020, and if I had to hazard a guess, younger folks are going to prefer non dairy alternatives (for a variety of reasons). https://www.theguardian.com/food/2…

What about cheese? It seems popular.

Re: Milk alternatives produce up to 4.5x less greenhouse gas emissions as milk

#52

Post by vinay427 »

joshlemer wrote: post #8
russianbandit wrote: post #4

And yet coffee shops that claim to be organic, eco conscious and fair trade still penalize you for opting for a milk alternative (by charging extra, like up to $1).

This really pisses me off, even starbucks charges like a dollar for almond/oat milk.

This charge was finally removed a few months ago at their UK locations, so it seems more or less inevitable in the US given that the UK is often a vegan/plant-based testbed for many US chains: https://plantbasednews.org/lifestyle/food/starbucks-ends-veg...

Re: Milk alternatives produce up to 4.5x less greenhouse gas emissions as milk

#53

Post by prideout »

FalconSensei wrote: post #12
russianbandit wrote: post #4

And yet coffee shops that claim to be organic, eco conscious and fair trade still penalize you for opting for a milk alternative (by charging extra, like up to $1).

The milk alternatives that can achieve the same foaminess can cost 2x the price of regular milk, so I guess it makes sense

Which milk alternatives can achieve the same foaminess?

Re: Milk alternatives produce up to 4.5x less greenhouse gas emissions as milk

#54

Post by sudden_dystopia »

As far as almond milk goes, how much water do almond trees consume in places that are already water scarce?

I really enjoy the new ultrafiltered cow milk that have come out recently. Half the sugar, no lactose but all of the protein.

Re: Milk alternatives produce up to 4.5x less greenhouse gas emissions as milk

#55

Post by citilife »

I'm curious the long-term side effects on the body. I'm not sure it's better, we're something like 10,000 years into developing the ability to drink milk. I'm not sure we know what the effects of high soy intake is (only 10-15 years into mass consumer adoption -- we do see massive drops in sex hormones; possibly related, it is correlated).

Also, I really dislike how these studies are conducted. They often don't account for the fact _something_ will be produced on land and _something_ will be consuming it. There used to be millions of American Buffalo roaming the plains. I'm not sure relatively normal behavior is something to be concerned about.

The pollution IMO we should be concerned about are the chemicals in production of industry and food which are not natural. For instance, giant mono-crops of soy, which then go to factories where they are heavily processed, might be in-effect worse for the ecosystem as a whole. Another example is almond production. It takes far too much water to produce almonds and to make milk is insane.

I personally wouldn't be surprised if the soy, oat, almond industry are pushing these studies.

Re: Milk alternatives produce up to 4.5x less greenhouse gas emissions as milk

#56

Post by unicornporn »

Reason077 wrote: post #22

I'm not vegan or anything, but I've found oat milk not only tastes great on cereal etc, but it also keeps fresh for much longer in the fridge. I've pretty much given up buying cow's milk now days, unless I have a specific recipe or something that calls for it. Cheese, on the other hand, I can't see myself giving up any time soon!

When it comes to Oatly... It tastes good, but that's because it contains plenty of sugars. You'll notice the difference when you make your own oat milk from oats. It's tastes quite terrible actually.

Oatly adds enzymes to break down the starches to sugar.

https://www.gq.com/story/oatly-nutrition-ipo

Re: Milk alternatives produce up to 4.5x less greenhouse gas emissions as milk

#57

Post by wyager »

candiddevmike wrote: post #47
denimnerd42 wrote: post #32

Milk alternatives don't have any benefits in children. Milk drinking in children is thought to induce growth. You can't overdo it though as it interferes with iron absorption. https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-020-63647-8 see the references height difference found: https://academic.oup.com/ajcn/article/106/2/597/4557638 may be related to IGF-1: https://www.nature.com/articles/1601948

Do we need big kids? Milk has a ton of calories and could be contributing to childhood obesity: https://nutritionfacts.org/2017/03/16/how-milk-may-contribut...

Kids aren't getting fat off milk. We can a priori expect milk satiety response to be well calibrated.

Re: Milk alternatives produce up to 4.5x less greenhouse gas emissions as milk

#58

Post by xattt »

denimnerd42 wrote: post #32

Milk alternatives don't have any benefits in children. Milk drinking in children is thought to induce growth. You can't overdo it though as it interferes with iron absorption. https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-020-63647-8 see the references height difference found: https://academic.oup.com/ajcn/article/106/2/597/4557638 may be related to IGF-1: https://www.nature.com/articles/1601948

Milk should be the beverage of choice for growing kids who do not have contraindications. 3.25% milk is recommended up until 2 years of age, and to continue into older age if there are no issues with obesity.

(1) https://www.albertahealthservices.ca/assets/info/nutrition/i...

Re: Milk alternatives produce up to 4.5x less greenhouse gas emissions as milk

#59

Post by Symmetry »

bin_bash wrote: post #33
SirensOfTitan wrote: post #17

Questions that come to mind: 1. What percentage of land use for dairy cows is arable? 2. What percentage of water consumed by dairy cows is recycled (eg from rain water), how does that compare to something like almonds? 3. What percentage of greenhouse gas emissions are added to the environment over already existing in the environment and just being moved?

If it’s not arable then the cow’s food has to come from arable land somewhere else. You can’t just put a cow on a rock and expect it to produce milk.

Between land that gets enough rain for intensive cultivation without draining aquifers and land that's a barren desert there's a wide range and you can still graze cows on most of it, though it takes more land per cow in drier areas.

Re: Milk alternatives produce up to 4.5x less greenhouse gas emissions as milk

#60

Post by xutopia »

cyberlurker wrote: post #24

Oat milk tastes pretty good and from the charts it’s a good balance between land and water use and emissions given. I keep a smaller carton of milk next to a similar sized oat milk one these days. My only concern is if some studies will come out in a few years showing oat milk health effects similar to what is being discovered about soy. I don’t have all knowledge on this, but apparently soy can mess with hormones. I…

The fear surrounding soy milk were unfounded. No studies have shown an impact on us but the proposition that it could is very persistent.
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