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Coast on Clojure

coast.swlkr.com

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Re: Coast on Clojure

#51

Post by rawoke083600 »

swlkr wrote: post #30
phyrex wrote: post #20

I loved Coast and wrote at least one production app with it (and very quickly and pleasantly at that), but it needs to be said that swlkr is the only developer, and he seems to have mostly moved on to Janet ( https://janet-lang.org/ ). Case in point, the last real updates to Coast were 2 years ago, and - unlike other Clojure libraries - not because this project was /finished/.

Yeah, I did move on, but if someone were to pick up the torch, I would help out any way I can!

janet looks really really good ! I like the use of channels for m.t

Any good HTTP/JSON/Crawler examples or libraries ?

Re: Coast on Clojure

#52

Post by capableweb »

rawoke083600 wrote: post #51
swlkr wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, I did move on, but if someone were to pick up the torch, I would help out any way I can!

janet looks really really good ! I like the use of channels for m.t Any good HTTP/JSON/Crawler examples or libraries ?

libcurl wrapper - https://github.com/sepisoad/jurl

json encoder/decoder - https://github.com/janet-lang/json

Not aware of any HTML parsers/traverses (if that's what you mean with "Crawler") but interfacing with C libraries is easy so grab any C library you'd like for that task.

Re: Coast on Clojure

#53

Post by terinjokes »

rawoke083600 wrote: post #50
muhgarvey wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He wrote a blog post about it https://swlkr.com/posts/clojure-isnt-for-me/ TLDR: He hated the Java part of Clojure

Ja that is always like a little splinter in my brain as well. I hope I don't bring out the language-wars but I always wanted a Clojure-Like but with Golang. :) I just love the go ecosystem and statistically compiled binary ! You shipping one binary ! :) No need to edit XML files and "tune java servers" Again, this is just my preference. YMMYV There are a few projects that try todo this like this one: https://github.c…

I keep staring projects like this, but I haven't found the right level to put a lisp in the Go stack.

I've done a runtime lisp, but it felt like programming a lisp isolated from everything that made Go, well, Go. I've done a simple lisp to generate Go AST to do codegen pre-1.18, but that's not a complete program.

I haven't found the place yet that feels quite like Clojure.

Re: Coast on Clojure

#54

Post by adamkl »

capableweb wrote: post #36
adamkl wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I like that quote, but it's the Rails idioms and conventions that make hairballs, not the fact that it includes a bunch of batteries.

Adopting any framework is quite literally adopting the framework's idioms and conventions so not sure how that is different.

It was a general comment about frameworks. It’s possible to have a framework that includes all the “batteries” but has idioms and conventions that promote simplicity and maintenance.

Rails chose idioms and conventions that prioritize speed at the cost of complexity. The “included batteries” are not the problem.

Re: Coast on Clojure

#55

Post by janetacarr »

jwr wrote: post #47
janetacarr wrote: post #15

This is cool, but, aside from error messages, it resembles Clojure's biggest problem right now: Everyone keeps trying to re-invent the wheel with respect to creating the "Rails" for Clojure. We have several production grade libraries and frameworks for serving webpages. Reitit(router), yada(http standards), bidi(router), aleph (netty wrapper), ring (jetty wrapper), pedestal (bundle of libraries), luminus (self descri…

Hmm. Can you give some examples of those missing libraries? I've been developing and running a large SaaS for the last several years and never found lack of libraries to be a problem.

Well, the biggest glaring thing is Clojure.spec. It's quite literally still in alpha (clojure.spec.alpha), and is a core part of Clojure, but everyone uses it in production anyways. (I might be biased here, I have opinions on whether or not clojure.spec should even be part of Clojure)

For example, things like clj-stripe, Matchbox(firebase lib) Onyx(MapReduce lib), and Cortex(ML lib) are all out of date.

One thing I see a lot from companies using Clojure(script) is they fork open source projects, extend them for their needs, and never contribute back.

Clojurescript libraries in particular are extremely bad for this. For example, re-frame-firebase has suffered some serious bit rot lately, the core repo uses firebase sdk 5.7, and hasn't ever really been used in a production setting!

Anyways, not trying to call out these library maintainers because I do understand maintaining libraries is time consuming. I'm trying to call out companies taking from the community and not giving back.

Re: Coast on Clojure

#56

Post by swlkr »

rawoke083600 wrote: post #50
muhgarvey wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He wrote a blog post about it https://swlkr.com/posts/clojure-isnt-for-me/ TLDR: He hated the Java part of Clojure

Ja that is always like a little splinter in my brain as well. I hope I don't bring out the language-wars but I always wanted a Clojure-Like but with Golang. :) I just love the go ecosystem and statistically compiled binary ! You shipping one binary ! :) No need to edit XML files and "tune java servers" Again, this is just my preference. YMMYV There are a few projects that try todo this like this one: https://github.c…

there is joker https://github.com/candid82/joker but you may as well use the small clojure interpreter instead

Re: Coast on Clojure

#57

Post by jcadam »

hangonhn wrote: post #48
LesZedCB wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

any experience with rails or django to compare with?

Not to be pedantic but you’re asking for a comparison of language vs. frameworks. Not sure if you’ll get a good answer to that. That said, I’ve actually used Rails and Django in the past and written a small project in Clojure so I can try. I actually really love Clojure and had really positive experiences wit Django though I’ve come to favor lighter frameworks like Starlette. Programming in Clojure is quite interesti…

Correct. I like ruby the language. Rails, not so much.

Re: Coast on Clojure

#58

Post by rafram »

jtth wrote: post #34
phyrex wrote: post #20

I loved Coast and wrote at least one production app with it (and very quickly and pleasantly at that), but it needs to be said that swlkr is the only developer, and he seems to have mostly moved on to Janet ( https://janet-lang.org/ ). Case in point, the last real updates to Coast were 2 years ago, and - unlike other Clojure libraries - not because this project was /finished/.

biff ( https://biffweb.com/ ) is a little more batteries-included but seems like a nice successor in this space

Its default stack includes an AppleScript-like language that compiles to JS (Hyperscript) and a “feature” that automatically deploys to production every time you save… Doesn’t exactly inspire confidence.

Re: Coast on Clojure

#59

Post by pull_my_finger »

phyrex wrote: post #20

I loved Coast and wrote at least one production app with it (and very quickly and pleasantly at that), but it needs to be said that swlkr is the only developer, and he seems to have mostly moved on to Janet ( https://janet-lang.org/ ). Case in point, the last real updates to Coast were 2 years ago, and - unlike other Clojure libraries - not because this project was /finished/.

He made a similar framework for Janet lang in Joy Framework[1] and it's unironically a joy to work with. Joy is one of those tools that is almost enough to make you use a different language imo. Got it where it counts, but still minimal and low mental overhead.

[1]: https://joy.swlkr.com/

Re: Coast on Clojure

#60

Post by LesZedCB »

hangonhn wrote: post #48
LesZedCB wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

any experience with rails or django to compare with?

Not to be pedantic but you’re asking for a comparison of language vs. frameworks. Not sure if you’ll get a good answer to that. That said, I’ve actually used Rails and Django in the past and written a small project in Clojure so I can try. I actually really love Clojure and had really positive experiences wit Django though I’ve come to favor lighter frameworks like Starlette. Programming in Clojure is quite interesti…

sorry, i also use clojure for hobby projects and am familiar with clojure/repl/etc.

i guess i assumed that since this thread was about web frameworks that their large clojure code base was also a web application. though i see that isn't necessarily implied.

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