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New EU law could require iMessage and WhatsApp to work with other platforms

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Re: New EU law could require iMessage and WhatsApp to work with other platforms

#51

Post by Retric »

hetspookjee wrote: post #41
Retric wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Beyond privacy concerns, it’s also going to open these and many other services up to an unending wave of SPAM. So, I wouldn’t assume it’s great for end users without digging into the details. Don’t forget the last time they did privacy regulations they created an unending wave of click yes to accept cookies. PS: Looking at rapid downvotes I see people disagree, but mandatory interoperability would presumably force th…

Luckily we’re kept totally safe by our benevolent overlords. Except for our good friend Jeff Bezos that got hacked through a WhatsApp image. Or the overt spam that any publicly posted business WhatsApp number receives. WhatsApp replaced SMS as a free alternative with media. Sms is just a protocol. It is not necessary that a replacement is walled garden, especially not under the sole guise of spam protection - somethi…

iMessage and WhatsApp are just a tiny selection of social networks.

Depending in the specifics everything from Yahoo! Messenger to MMO chat either needs to get shut down or made interoperable.

Re: New EU law could require iMessage and WhatsApp to work with other platforms

#52

Post by RenThraysk »

viccuad wrote: post #44
RenThraysk wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Imagine there is a break in a cryptographic algorithm, say AES256-CBC. Now can I replace it in my messaging app, without having to coordinate with every other messaging app provider? Suddenly governments have a lever to prevent adoption of securer standards.

Why wouldn't you be able to bump the API of your messaging app? Sounds orthogonal to me. You are required to publish a working and open API. You are doing it. They can consume the new API with the new default cypher.

So no guarantee of interoperability.

Re: New EU law could require iMessage and WhatsApp to work with other platforms

#53

Post by teekert »

stingraycharles wrote: post #50
teekert wrote: post #46

This annoys me. Rather than robbing Moxie of his vision and forcing Meta to break their business model, why do governments not just lead by example? Start using Matrix, we all know that the signup process could be easier (among many other things), throw some money and devs at the project with that specific goal. Start offering services over Matrix. Public money, public code. The whole world benefits.

Why would requiring interoperability rob Moxie of his vision?

He indicated multiple times that he does not want other (third party) clients, does not want the server to be open and federated. Let him have it, it works for many people.

Imagine you were him and you are getting issues filed from people using services the government forced you to build, or were even build by others but forced on your once clean solution. I'd say "screw you guys, I'm going home" (Build your own solution). And I'd agree with him. Where would it end?

Re: New EU law could require iMessage and WhatsApp to work with other platforms

#55

Post by egberts1 »

supermatt wrote: post #4
egberts1 wrote: post #2

Yeah, and trade certain security for certain freedom?

They could implement EXACTLY the same security requirements via a public-facing API as they do via their existing "private" API. How would that be trading security? lack of obscurity? Clearly they cant be expected to integrate with any 3rd party, so the expectation is that 3rd parties would integrate with them. You can do this at present via their private API (as per pidgin, etc) - but thats against their terms of se…

Karma be damned. Uncomfortable truth must be made cognizant.

But they won’t do it exactly given their widely disparate privacy and security model. Unless some kind of an instant messaging standard surfaces.

As is, it would become another cat-n-mouse security theater in leveraging one IM provider’s API weakness to gain additional insight of a subscriber using another IM provider’s API.

Re: New EU law could require iMessage and WhatsApp to work with other platforms

#56

Post by A4ET8a8uTh0 »

Sakos wrote: post #14

I miss the days when I could fire up Pidgin (or Gaim when I started using it) and instantly connect to every IM service I ever needed. Hopefully this is a step back towards that.

Agreed. It genuinely feels like my online experience degraded over the course of the past decade or so, because I am less willing to join a specific walled garden. And then I remember that this is by design. The winner takes his/hers social circle to the winner garden.

Re: New EU law could require iMessage and WhatsApp to work with other platforms

#57

Post by thinkmassive »

tinus_hn wrote: post #45
rewq4321 wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why? If your messaging app doesn't have the ability to block stranger requests, why are you still using it? And even if you for some reason don't want to restrict your requests, you'll probably still be fine - Gmail handles protects me from spam pretty well.

Good luck blocking a person that pretends to be 10000 different strangers.

“block stranger requests” could mean using your contacts as an allowlist

Re: New EU law could require iMessage and WhatsApp to work with other platforms

#58

Post by stingraycharles »

teekert wrote: post #53
stingraycharles wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would requiring interoperability rob Moxie of his vision?

He indicated multiple times that he does not want other (third party) clients, does not want the server to be open and federated. Let him have it, it works for many people. Imagine you were him and you are getting issues filed from people using services the government forced you to build, or were even build by others but forced on your once clean solution. I'd say "screw you guys, I'm going home" (Build your own solu…

The same can be said about WhatsApp et al. I’m going to bet that Meta also indicated they don’t want other third party clients.

From my point of view, the advantages of opening up these platforms outweigh the disadvantages for those who don’t like that.

The whole idea of this type of regulation is that it tries to do what’s best for the consumer, and the market as a whole, not not necessarily for the businesses behind it.

Re: New EU law could require iMessage and WhatsApp to work with other platforms

#59

Post by viccuad »

RenThraysk wrote: post #52
viccuad wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why wouldn't you be able to bump the API of your messaging app? Sounds orthogonal to me. You are required to publish a working and open API. You are doing it. They can consume the new API with the new default cypher.

So no guarantee of interoperability.

> So no guarantee of interoperability.

Why not? Can you come up with examples? Are you worried that they would use automation to generate a new "API" per second, so consumers would need to play catch-up? Do you think that would hold in court, if/when this initiative has been legislated?

Re: New EU law could require iMessage and WhatsApp to work with other platforms

#60

Post by Jcowell »

tinus_hn wrote: post #45
rewq4321 wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why? If your messaging app doesn't have the ability to block stranger requests, why are you still using it? And even if you for some reason don't want to restrict your requests, you'll probably still be fine - Gmail handles protects me from spam pretty well.

Good luck blocking a person that pretends to be 10000 different strangers.

Exactly this. Exactly if the common protocol is SMS/MMS. So what if I can block people on one platform they can just now hop to another.
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