Wow! Compare this to Hollywood, always telling us how to think and behave but otherwise happy to turn a blind eye on Uighyrs etc if they can sell a few more tickets.
Steve Simon announces WTA’s decision to suspend tournaments in China
51–60 of 113 posts
Re: Steve Simon announces WTA’s decision to suspend tournaments in China
#52Earlier quoted context omitted.
As someone who's been at the receiving end of "applying pressure" (sanctions and bombing), it effectively did nothing to harm those in power, but instead only made innocent people suffer even more. "Ideals" are not a constant, and each and everyone has their own. There are values we should strive to protect, but disenfranchising whole nation for the minority (not that long ago, USA had a minority government when it c…
What is this moral relativism? If you want to live in a world where disappearing people for speaking up, heavy handed state censorship and social credit score are all common practices - I suggest you buy one way ticket to China. It’s easy to talk all of this “liberal” bs while sipping your latte at your local Starbucks, but when it comes down to it you know very well what is right and what is wrong: you make the dist…
You may have missed the nuance between wanting to live in a state like China, and not boycotting all business with people from China.
In fact, people in China will likely reach the boiling point sooner if their economic "advantage" of lower salaries and cheaper production are brought to a level of their Western counterparts faster (which means, doing business with Chinese people).
Boycotting will do nothing to help them. Accepting them and letting them experience the benefits of a freer society will introduce more dissenting voices.
As for what world we live in, it's pretty much like that even in modern democracies (other than disappearing people, but they usually end up self-censoring or committing suicide themselves when the pressure from media is too high).
Re: Steve Simon announces WTA’s decision to suspend tournaments in China
#53Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Or when unfairness accumulates enough that they had enough — this will happen at some point in China, if they don't tone it down. CCP has built a dissent management stack all the way from early indoctrination to continuous surveillance to Tiananmen style intervention/massacre if the need ever arises. Dissent will be crushed before it becomes a movement. We're looking at one of the greatest threats to our freedom ev…
I have trust in the human race that they will reach a boiling point, and no mechanism can stop that from spiralling out — it's been like that throughout the history. I don't see nukes as of any use (nuking their own dissenting population would surely trigger a civil war: nobody will take that) — nukes are mostly there to deter external invaders (as soon as you use them, that deterring value is gone)! Their economy is…
Nah, it's clear eusocial species are more fit. Soon comrades in China will engineer a better human, incapable of dissent, working tirelessly for the glory of the Party. This man will rapidly outcompete the silly mono-animal organisms and nation-state slime molds and usher in a great era of eternal harmony.
Re: Steve Simon announces WTA’s decision to suspend tournaments in China
#54Kudos! As oblivious bystander and no real tennis-knowledge apart from how the game is played, how much pressure will this put on China? How much weight does WTA carry? It will no doubt cause some media coverage no matter the outcome.
I don't see the chinesse people raising against CCP for this. Not even if the olympics are cancelled. It's well-known that CCP leaders are untouchable in China just like Kim is untouchable in NK. On the other hand if you look a bit to our politics, how affected was Trump by the rape/harrasment accusations? Certainly a big part of population would still vote for him even if the rape would be recorded. I don't defend C…
> censorship and persecution of the victims.
Having her "disappeared" by the government is a step far beyond what usually happens in the West, but suppression of the victims in some way is still an extremely big problem and is what the whole "#metoo" movement was about.
Re: Steve Simon announces WTA’s decision to suspend tournaments in China
#55Kudos! As oblivious bystander and no real tennis-knowledge apart from how the game is played, how much pressure will this put on China? How much weight does WTA carry? It will no doubt cause some media coverage no matter the outcome.
The better question is how much pressure does it put on other organisations when it comes to bowing to China? Or any other rich, not-so-democratic country like Saudi or Qatar, or... Because now the WTA, by no means a small sports organisation, did what the IOC, FIFA, NBA, film studios,... didn't have the courage to do. And these orgs now don't have any excuse of doing nothing about those human rights abuses.
>And these orgs now don't have any excuse of doing nothing about those human rights abuses.
Money still exists. Real WTA test is to see if they continue suspension once post covid PRC opens up. PRC already cancelled WTA events prior to suspension, likely past 2022 pending on how covid pans out. Short term this is cost free marketting WTA. IOC, FIFA, NBA, film studios still has costs, and they still choose China.
Re: Steve Simon announces WTA’s decision to suspend tournaments in China
#56Earlier quoted context omitted.
I have trust in the human race that they will reach a boiling point, and no mechanism can stop that from spiralling out — it's been like that throughout the history. I don't see nukes as of any use (nuking their own dissenting population would surely trigger a civil war: nobody will take that) — nukes are mostly there to deter external invaders (as soon as you use them, that deterring value is gone)! Their economy is…
Nah, it's clear eusocial species are more fit. Soon comrades in China will engineer a better human, incapable of dissent, working tirelessly for the glory of the Party. This man will rapidly outcompete the silly mono-animal organisms and nation-state slime molds and usher in a great era of eternal harmony.
LOL — thanks for a lighter spin on the discussion!
Re: Steve Simon announces WTA’s decision to suspend tournaments in China
#57Earlier quoted context omitted.
I’m not white and I don’t believe it’s right that a woman should be politically silenced for speaking out about sexual abuse she encountered. Perhaps not everything is about ‘sticking it’ to your homeland.
Actually no evidence she has been silenced. You I'm sure do not want to 'stick it' to China, but you are perhaps unwittingly playing your little part in that process. Ironic also how the comment yours above has been censored for not towing the Western line.
There is, in fact, evidence that she has been silenced.
Re: Steve Simon announces WTA’s decision to suspend tournaments in China
#58Earlier quoted context omitted.
Reaction to a scandal is one of those things where you really see the difference between a democracy, imperfect as it might be, and a tyrannical regime. In democracy, scandal brings disgrace and resignations; the office-holder has demonstrated to be morally unfit and lost his right to lead. In tyranny, you get silence and threats; the boss rules because he is the boss , not because of any moral superiority recognised…
I didn't see any of that happen when Trump was in power or is that an aberration.
Try it if anyone other than trump. He is quite unusual. But any others.
The communist is on the other hand … could she be the exception not coming out as the bad ladies to apology, to be suicide or what.
Re: Steve Simon announces WTA’s decision to suspend tournaments in China
#59Earlier quoted context omitted.
I don't see the chinesse people raising against CCP for this. Not even if the olympics are cancelled. It's well-known that CCP leaders are untouchable in China just like Kim is untouchable in NK. On the other hand if you look a bit to our politics, how affected was Trump by the rape/harrasment accusations? Certainly a big part of population would still vote for him even if the rape would be recorded. I don't defend C…
Trump was a bit of a special case, for whatever reason. No other presidential candidacy would have made it thirty seconds beyond the "Grab 'em by the pussy" scandal.
You mean like Clinton/Lewinsky case? I mean sure, being more eloquent and better mannered is all the difference.
Re: Steve Simon announces WTA’s decision to suspend tournaments in China
#60Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Or when unfairness accumulates enough that they had enough — this will happen at some point in China, if they don't tone it down. CCP has built a dissent management stack all the way from early indoctrination to continuous surveillance to Tiananmen style intervention/massacre if the need ever arises. Dissent will be crushed before it becomes a movement. We're looking at one of the greatest threats to our freedom ev…
I have trust in the human race that they will reach a boiling point, and no mechanism can stop that from spiralling out — it's been like that throughout the history. I don't see nukes as of any use (nuking their own dissenting population would surely trigger a civil war: nobody will take that) — nukes are mostly there to deter external invaders (as soon as you use them, that deterring value is gone)! Their economy is…
> as they are quickly catching up in salaries and standard of living, it will level off (sure, their domestic market is huge as well and gives them another few years or a decade).
Extremely naive. There are plenty of dirt rich countries, countries way more well off than USA which are still completely totalitarian.