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Three sins of authors in computer science and math (1997)

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Re: Three sins of authors in computer science and math (1997)

#51
post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This seems somewhat ungenerous. This article was written in 1997, barely a year after the CSS standard was released. If anything, it's a failing of browsers to not render basic html in a palatable way. One day, I truly wish to come to hacker news and not have this type of comment be the first thing that people decide is worth posting.

I don't think it is. I thought about it quite a bit before posting, actually. The entire page I'm critiquing is itself a critique of poor methods of communication. That's the only reason I bothered to post a critique at all. If someone's going to post a rant about how people aren't writing their papers well, I definitely see them as fair game for a critique on how they chose to communicate that to the reader. You can…

Nowhere in the essay you read does the author criticize presentation of text on the page. He critiques the actual content of technical papers. You are critiquing his use of CSS (or lack thereof).

Re: Three sins of authors in computer science and math (1997)

#52
The author seems to value direct, polished prose. Surely some academic writing is direct and polished, but most of it isn't.

Writing an academic paper is the existential obligation of its authors. There's something in there that you want to get across to somebody, but the rest of it be damned. I'd expect the quality of the prose to be a low priority, not unlike in much developer documentation, school book reports, speeches, and other writing that is mostly filler to meet an obligation.

Re: Three sins of authors in computer science and math (1997)

#53
My view, from math, computing, and computer science is (1) that the author is being too critical and often throwing out a small but good baby with some not very dirty bathwater and (2) that he is not mentioning some larger problems, worse "sins".

Here would be my list of the worst sins or how to avoid them:

(1) A term is a word used with other than a standard dictionary definition. Technical fields are awash in terms. Make sure to try hard to define all the terms you use; with some judgment applied, can omit definitions of some terms certainly well understood by any reader with enough background to get anything from the paper. Poorly or undefined terms can be one of the best ways to lose readers. Here, hoping to get more readers, maybe inviting them into the field, bend over backwards in defining terms, that is, maybe give some term definitions for readers who, really, have little hope of getting much from the paper -- at least, when such a reader gives up they won't blame the author!

In addition, for any term new or relatively new to the field, with some judgment, might also include for the term motivation of its importance and examples of its usage -- i.e., make clear the importance, relevance, value, usage, etc. of the term.

(2) For nearly all acronyms, standard in the field or not, for the first use of the acronym include what it abbreviates. Here to be sure are doing well on this issue, strain and bend over backwards and include, say, even TCP (transmission control protocol), SMTP (simple mail transfer protocol), CPU (central processing unit) -- sure, I'm suggesting bending over backwards. Several slaps on the wrist, an hour in the corner with wearing a dunce cap, and a coating of tar and feathers for each acronym used but not defined with what it abbreviates.

(3) For how to write math, in two parts, (A) and (B):

(A) Take some theorem proving courses from some of the most precisely written texts, say, P. Halmos, Finite Dimensional Vector Spaces, W. Rudin, Principles of Mathematical Analysis, Neveu, Mathematical Foundations of the Calculus of Probability, E. Nering, Linear Algebra and Matrix Theory, Royden, Real Analysis where do a lot of the exercises as homework and where the professor DOES read and remark on your writing. Neveu was a Loeve student at Berkeley. Nering was an Artin student at Princeton. As I recall, Rudin's background was in Austria, although I don't know who his professors were. Of course, Royden was long at Stanford. For more, if have time and insist on some really good examples, read some of Bourbaki.

By the way, on use of we, that is standard. So we might have,

"Given topological spaces X and Y and a function f: X --> Y, we say that function f is continuous provided for each set B open in Y f^(-1)(B) is open in X.

So, that's a vanilla example of using we in mathematical writing.

(B) Do some things none of those texts do: Include some intuitive views, some helpful pictures, motivation via applications in math and also outside math, and outlines of research directions.

There is a lot of question about how appropriate is suggestion (B); in math my guess is that there is no question about the relevance, wisdom, importance, value, etc. of suggestion (A).

For the goal of writing math, suggestion (A) is important: Tough to expect good success without the texts I listed or other texts written with similar care. That level of care is extreme, tough to find and learn, and much tougher to do. Writing math with the care of those texts seems to have been understood and practiced significantly often only after about 1950 or 1940. And for at least one course from at least one such text, DO have the good homework grading of a good math professor.

Personal experience and lesson: While I'm not much interested in being a professor, I have published some papers, and from getting those papers reviewed my guess would be that about half of the reason the papers passed review, and they always did with no significant revision or difficulty, is that I wrote the math with nearly the care and precision of, say, W. Rudin. Point: To critical readers, any lapse in that level of care and precision can be like a worm in a baked apple, perhaps otherwise terrific from brown sugar, butter, etc. Or, might guess that, in nearly any field, the good work is less than 10% of the total, maybe less than 1%, with the rest flawed, maybe as bad as that apple with a worm. In writing math, it is way too easy to be in the bottom 99% or 90% just from the care and precision of the writing, and suggestion (A) is IMHO (in my humble opinion) a good way to have at least the writing quality keep you in the top 90+%.

For math used in computer science, for how to write that math carefully, there are of course examples from D. Knuth.

Re: Three sins of authors in computer science and math (1997)

#54
post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think it is. I thought about it quite a bit before posting, actually. The entire page I'm critiquing is itself a critique of poor methods of communication. That's the only reason I bothered to post a critique at all. If someone's going to post a rant about how people aren't writing their papers well, I definitely see them as fair game for a critique on how they chose to communicate that to the reader. You can…

Nowhere in the essay you read does the author criticize presentation of text on the page. He critiques the actual content of technical papers. You are critiquing his use of CSS (or lack thereof).

I think it's a bit more nuanced that that, since he's also talking about placement of points and descriptive sentences and how it turns into a type of table of contents, which is a bit of both content and presentation in my opinion, but I could see how you might differ on that point. To me, data presentation and making it palatable to those intended to consume it is important, and not easily teased apart from the data itself when viewed with respect to communication.

For what it's worth, if you look at the source of the page, you can see how he actually does seem to care about line length with respect to legibility for himself, it just doesn't seem to extend to something he cares about with respect to his readers.

Re: Three sins of authors in computer science and math (1997)

#55

I disagree with a lot of this. My perspective comes from reading papers in mathematics and physics, not computing, however. Regarding "grandmothering": I agree with the criticism of the first example. Explaining basic points of the field in a vague way is obviously not helpful. The second example is not as compelling. The key point is that the "..." after "In recent years, the study of preconditioners for iterative m…

Another practical point concerning grandmothering is journal editors. Journal editors are often not experts in the specific subfield of the paper and almost certainly won't read much further than the first 1-2 paragraphs. Thus, the first 1-2 paragraphs must, in addition to stating what the paper does, give sufficient context to convince a lazy editor that the topic is important enough to be the focus of a paper in their journal. In my experience, grandmothering is often trying to achieve this purpose.

Re: Three sins of authors in computer science and math (1997)

#56
post #2

At first I thought the author was purposefully eschewing any useful formatting to make a point later about how this work itself would be easier to read if a minimal amount of formatting was provided to make it more palatable to those reading it, but no, upon checking other pages of theirs, and even loading up developer tools in case some CSS file was failing to load (and finding none), it seems this author is blind t…

It seems perfectly readable to me. I appreciate that it is almost all meat and no filler.

Re: Three sins of authors in computer science and math (1997)

#57
post #2

At first I thought the author was purposefully eschewing any useful formatting to make a point later about how this work itself would be easier to read if a minimal amount of formatting was provided to make it more palatable to those reading it, but no, upon checking other pages of theirs, and even loading up developer tools in case some CSS file was failing to load (and finding none), it seems this author is blind t…

Blame your browser for being crap at doing the main thing it was created for: Rendering good old plain HTML.

Re: Three sins of authors in computer science and math (1997)

#58
post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At least in CS venues, page limits disincentivize formatting that takes up more space—even when it's more readable.

another reason why we should get rid of page limits

I don't want to review for a conference with no page limits.

Re: Three sins of authors in computer science and math (1997)

#59
The bigger and more interesting point is how to navigate the world of research where everyone is convinced their way is the only right way. I paragraph-TOCs, but my reviewer insists on including it. This article is an example.

We need a better way to establish consensus for things that can be standardised and we need more taste and tolerance for things where opinions can differ.

Re: Three sins of authors in computer science and math (1997)

#60

I disagree with a lot of this. My perspective comes from reading papers in mathematics and physics, not computing, however. Regarding "grandmothering": I agree with the criticism of the first example. Explaining basic points of the field in a vague way is obviously not helpful. The second example is not as compelling. The key point is that the "..." after "In recent years, the study of preconditioners for iterative m…

>> These citations serve to point the reader to the recent works mentioned in the sentence, which may not be readily accessible to someone who doesn't actively do research in that area but is otherwise knowledgeable about numerical computing.

CS papers typically have a "Related Work" section for this. I agree with the author that the Intorduction section should be used to introduce the work to a reader who will proably not read anything else.

Actually, to be honest, I hate structured writing and I hate that research papers are always written as if they were meant to be read by 5-year olds with ADHD, but I know that the way most people read most papers is to read the abstract, skim the Introduction, browse the graphs in the Experiments section and then check the Conclusions section to see if they missed anything. I'm guilty of that too. There are way too many papers and too little time to read them all carefully. So papers end up written to be skimmed rather than read.

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