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New Surface products, built for Windows 11

blogs.windows.com

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Re: New Surface products, built for Windows 11

#51

Post by elorant »

bigmattystyles wrote: post #14

Fuck that noise Jack; I recently updated my home computer and had to install Windows 10 from scratch - Even its setup seems to have changed for the worst since I originally installed it on my now defunct PC. I have the Pro edition (that I paid $200 for) - using the latest ISO, the whole setup just felt user and privacy hostile. I remembered that it would try to make me use my Hotmail account as a user account, but wh…

I'm on the same boat. While .net development is a breeze, the Windows ecosystem is a drag. I wish they could provide a Windows for Devs edition that would be stripped down to the bare minimal. The problem with Windows is that it's trying to be everything for everyone. One OS for multiple devices, instead of separating mobile/tablet from desktop as Apple did. Thus every stupid idea they come with is embedded in all versions of the OS. I'm serious contemplating the idea of moving to Linux, and the only thing that's holding me back is Visual Studio.

The one thing I can't stand about Windows is that they've added a bazillion of settings. It literally took me 6 hours a day just to go into every freaking setting in Control Panel, and I can't even remember where is everything. You have menus on the left, menus on the right, extra links on the bottom, a clusterfuck of UI design. For fuck's sake Microsoft, I just need an OS to do my work.

Re: New Surface products, built for Windows 11

#52

Post by elorant »

dgellow wrote: post #23
skinkestek wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yet they have been advertising its problems I think. I'm not that into Windows though.

I have to say that I do not understand the bad press around Windows 11. I'm using the dev channel since it's available and while things have been unstable (expected from a dev release), the user experience is clearly an improvement over the mess Windows 10 is. My machine doesn't feel slugish anymore, the Start menu and settings panel are finally usable, the new windows snapping features work quite well, managing exte…

How about scaling? Did they fix it because in Win10 it was horrendous.

Re: New Surface products, built for Windows 11

#53

Post by aksss »

stinos wrote: post #27
aksss wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or another Windows 8 misstep. They seem intent on releasing the product with a crippled start menu (zero customization and half of it seemingly reserved for ad space), the integrated teams chat is not compatible with work accounts, the widgets do not allow you to disable the news widget. I appreciate the typeface changes, though as a Windows user such things have never been a priority to me. What irks me is the loss…

Have you considered not bothering with manually going through the start menu but just typing what you want, or otherwise pinning mostly used apps to the taskbar? Both are faster and more convenient than point-search-click and taskbar allows grouping. Only downside: typing in the start menu does not always work flawlessly; can't pinpoint the exact problem but seems like there's some algorithm behind it which takes som…

Yep, search is a thing, but far from preferable to menu customization for me - not as hs/ld, in my opinion. Requires more input and more brain cycles to start typing a name with (potentially) both hands than to hit the win key and select the pictograph that’s immediately there in the same spot every time. It’s hardly a process of manually going through the start menu unless you need something unpinned. Having both options is great, but I like my regular ‘work tools’ laid out before me, arranged by activity - a pod of icons for my video/audio editing, a pod for dev work tools, a pod of icons for office apps, etc.

But yeah, in win11 search is more of a focus not because it’s a new feature compared to win10, but because they hobbled the other features, and that seems like an enormous step backwards to me (the loss of customization/options).

Win 11 lets you pin apps to the menu still, but there’s no grouping, half the menu is taken up by a “recommended” section, and there’s no resizing of it. For the unchangeable half of the menu, which so far as I can tell is not an MRU list, it does hold recently installed apps from the store (and nowhere else) and likely will be used to stub in advertised apps (call me cynical). It’s a crippling change, and I suspect we’ll see those features added back in sooner or later. Much like win8.1. That’s about the best I can hope for anyway. MS is intent to release as-is.

Re: New Surface products, built for Windows 11

#54

Post by hnbad »

mike_d wrote: post #2

Windows 11 seems to be a targeted competitor of iPad OS and just pretending desktops don't exist anymore. Hard to see the thinking in Microsoft's strategy here.

Meanwhile here I am on Windows 11 (via the dev channel) living the best life with my touch laptop that I use both for work and leisure.

Can you explain what makes you think Windows 11 "pretends desktops don't exist anymore"? If it's the product line-up revealed at this Surface event: the Surface line is explicitly a line of touch devices, so the focus on mobility seems on par.

Re: New Surface products, built for Windows 11

#56

Post by hardwaresofton »

mirages wrote: post #49
hardwaresofton wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know if anyone else has noticed, but Microsoft seems to almost be doing the missteps in a pattern/on purpose. Win95 vs Win98/ME/etc (? not sure) WinXP vs Vista Win7 vs Win8 Win10 vs Win11? It's like the Intel's tick-tock model almost. On some level I do think that bashing this is a bit hypocritical when most of us nerds are also the first ones to bemoan a lack of innovation.

It's more 95/98 -> 98SE ME -> 2000/XP Vista -> 7 8 -> 8.1 Can't say about 10 as the version numbers are harder to track

Thanks, I knew I was getting most of them wrong, haven't touched Windows in years, memory is very hazy

Re: New Surface products, built for Windows 11

#58

Post by wayneftw »

elorant wrote: post #51
bigmattystyles wrote: post #14

Fuck that noise Jack; I recently updated my home computer and had to install Windows 10 from scratch - Even its setup seems to have changed for the worst since I originally installed it on my now defunct PC. I have the Pro edition (that I paid $200 for) - using the latest ISO, the whole setup just felt user and privacy hostile. I remembered that it would try to make me use my Hotmail account as a user account, but wh…

I'm on the same boat. While .net development is a breeze, the Windows ecosystem is a drag. I wish they could provide a Windows for Devs edition that would be stripped down to the bare minimal. The problem with Windows is that it's trying to be everything for everyone. One OS for multiple devices, instead of separating mobile/tablet from desktop as Apple did. Thus every stupid idea they come with is embedded in all ve…

The last time I worked on a .NET Core (v2) project, I was able to do everything that I needed to on my Manjaro workstation.

One thing that I missed was SQL Server Management Studio, but Azure Data Studio was more than good enough and it even had some nice features that SSMS lacked, like project folders and GIT integration. SQL Server itself ran just fine in a Docker container.

A peer of mine is doing the same thing on the Manjaro desktop that I setup for him and he's using .NET Core v5.

Re: New Surface products, built for Windows 11

#59

Post by ffhhj »

hardwaresofton wrote: post #26
1_player wrote: post #3

I was holding off and waiting for a new Surface laptop or 2-in-1 until recently when: - Windows 11 was announced and proves to be another Vista-like misstep. - I have learned about Framework laptops and repairability and being able to upgrade one has become a killer feature.

I don't know if anyone else has noticed, but Microsoft seems to almost be doing the missteps in a pattern/on purpose. Win95 vs Win98/ME/etc (? not sure) WinXP vs Vista Win7 vs Win8 Win10 vs Win11? It's like the Intel's tick-tock model almost. On some level I do think that bashing this is a bit hypocritical when most of us nerds are also the first ones to bemoan a lack of innovation.

It's a two iteration learning process, and this time they need to learn people don't want ads and telemetry. Windows 12 will be privacy first.

Re: New Surface products, built for Windows 11

#60

Post by farnsworth »

dgellow wrote: post #29
farnsworth wrote: post #5

The surface duo is just such a great concept, compared to the folding screen phones. They avoid all the tech risk and expense of the folding screen phones, and the two screen form factor is just a legitimately good way to organize apps on a screen, like having two physical monitors. The tech seems too early for the folding screen phones, and they unfold into something which is an awkward shape. There's nothing I want…

I agree, it looks great. But the price is way too high! Starting price: 1599$?! Who can afford such a device, and what to do you actually do with something that expensive that you wouldn't do with a one-screen phone? If I sell my arm to buy something like this, which is basically the price of a good laptop, I expect a really, really special experience, I'm not sure the custom Android ROM Microsoft is using will be up…

Yeah, it still sort of has "early-adopter" pricing. It doesn't have the same market as, say, an iPhone. It's also working pointing out that the Galaxy Z Fold3 is $1799
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