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Dorothy Butler Gilliam: ‘I am not a maid, I am a reporter’

bbc.com

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Re: Dorothy Butler Gilliam: ‘I am not a maid, I am a reporter’

#51

Post by lexicality »

OJFord wrote: post #43
cirrus-clouds wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some examples from the UK: A few years ago (2016), a black MP (Member of Parliament) entered a members-only lift in the parliament building (House of Commons). Another MP (unamed) in the same lift told her: "This lift really isn't for cleaners." [1] More recently (September 2020), a black barrister (type of lawyer) was mistaken for a defendant three times in one day. Her experience was widely reported in the press. […

> A few years ago (2016), a black MP (Member of Parliament) entered a members-only lift in the parliament building (House of Commons). Another MP (unamed) in the same lift told her: "This lift really isn't for cleaners." [1] That surely can't have been a mistake, I don't know if the cleaners there are uniformed, but even if not I assume she would've been dressed more like an MP (the MP that she was) than a cleaner, e…

> [*] Assuming it's true - I must admit this sort of unnamed perpetrator, unverifiable story does strike me as a bit suspect. But I think that's fine anyway even if so, the specifics aren't really important, it can be a parable for how she feels generally on other (real) occasions.

You're right, I refuse to believe any sitting member of a governing body that [recently put out a report][1] saying Britain is the least racist country in the world could have deliberately tried to make a black MP feel unwelcome

[1]: https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/the-report-of-the...

Re: Dorothy Butler Gilliam: ‘I am not a maid, I am a reporter’

#52

Post by [deleted] »

hairofadog wrote: post #41
AzzieElbab wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

google Chicago shootings and then ask yourself why none of it made national headlines. Here is my first search result https://chicago.suntimes.com/crime/2021/8/21/22636162/chicag...

I don't understand what point you're making, but I have noticed that "google Chicago shootings" has become something of a racist dog whistle, so if that's not your intent there may be better phrasing with which to make it.

[deleted]

Re: Dorothy Butler Gilliam: ‘I am not a maid, I am a reporter’

#53

Post by hairofadog »

blueflow wrote: post #46
hairofadog wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand what point you're making, but I have noticed that "google Chicago shootings" has become something of a racist dog whistle, so if that's not your intent there may be better phrasing with which to make it.

Isn't "dog whistle" in this case just mental gymnastics to insinuate someone did somehow secretly say things even when neither meant to nor literally said it? Excuse my childish question, was that any different from purposefully misunderstanding your parent?

At the moment there are two other responses to my comment, and they both interpret the parent comment in completely opposite ways, so I'd offer that as support for my argument that the parent comment wasn't clear.

I'm using the term "dog whistle" here to mean a comment that appears to be innocuous, ambiguous, or harmless to anyone who doesn't already understand the reference, but which in fact has meaning or acts as a placeholder for a longer, well-tread narrative to people familiar with a particular subculture. In this case, the two ways it can be interpreted are spelled out pretty concisely by the first two responses here:

"The point he's making is that despite lip service by the media little has changed", which I take to mean, "Media still considers the deaths of black people to be cheap and therefore not worth reporting."

Then we have, "The point is black lives seem to matter only if taken by a white police officer", which is the dog-whistle version I was talking about. If that's the message someone is taking from the ambiguous phrase "google Chicago shootings", well, I can't think of a better illustration of the term "dog whistle".

Re: Dorothy Butler Gilliam: ‘I am not a maid, I am a reporter’

#54

Post by reacharavindh »

shrikant wrote: post #44
reacharavindh wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd be shocked if it were true. Where did you see such a law?

It sounded rubbish, so I looked it up and it's a thing! :-O https://www.dw.com/en/why-denmark-is-clamping-down-on-non-we...

I knew the immigration policies in DK were bad. But, not this bad. While I lived there, myself, and my Danish friends were embarrassed by the obviously discriminatory policies targeted at differently looking people. Particularly, the idiotic law about a handshake with he mayor to confirm naturalisation in Denmark. Under the assumption that Islamic women will hesitate to go through it. The rhetoric from the Folkeparty was always a cause of embarrassment in the Danish society. I did not live near the Copenhagen area where I imagine most immigrant neighbourhoods tend to be around. I realise that I may have been living 4 years a bubble and thinking everyone is so nice and liberal, and always care for the greater good.

It saddens me to know about such discrimination in a country that gets so many things right.

It breaks my heart to just read the following quote from the article linked above.

"I talk with children who are living in this area, and they believe they are Danish because they are born Danish, they have Danish passports, they speak Danish, they go to schools here — but people always tell them: 'You're not Danish because you're Muslim.'"

- This is not a hallmark of an open society. All the Danish people I know (in my apparent bubble) don't care about religion. Just let people be who they are, practice whatever religion they want. I wholeheartedly agree with not allowing anybody to impose their religion on others (this applies to the politicians imposing their beliefs on immigrants too).

I sincerely hope that things turn around for the better, and the reasonable voices of the Danish society votes the discriminatory people out.

Re: Dorothy Butler Gilliam: ‘I am not a maid, I am a reporter’

#55

Post by mikepurvis »

eplanit wrote: post #45
hairofadog wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand what point you're making, but I have noticed that "google Chicago shootings" has become something of a racist dog whistle, so if that's not your intent there may be better phrasing with which to make it.

The point is black lives seem to matter only if taken by a white police officer. The BLM movement is quite silent regarding other black deaths.

Is it? Definitely the most visible thing was the "defund" thing, but certainly in my circles I saw a lot of interest in reparations, housing reform, health care justice, etc, all with an eye toward addressing the generational economic issues that have led to or at least greatly exacerbated community violence.

Re: Dorothy Butler Gilliam: ‘I am not a maid, I am a reporter’

#56

Post by tom_ »

eplanit wrote: post #45
hairofadog wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand what point you're making, but I have noticed that "google Chicago shootings" has become something of a racist dog whistle, so if that's not your intent there may be better phrasing with which to make it.

The point is black lives seem to matter only if taken by a white police officer. The BLM movement is quite silent regarding other black deaths.

There's nothing wrong with holding the police to higher standards than criminals.

Re: Dorothy Butler Gilliam: ‘I am not a maid, I am a reporter’

#57

Post by darkwater »

tester34 wrote: post #32
imacerealkiller wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even if education is free, having time to study is also a luxury we take for granted. Going to university means a few more years of them not being able to work full-time and contribute to the household income. But for sure, if education was free it would improve access to education and restore some balance.

>Going to university means a few more years of them not being able to work full-time and contribute to the household income. But for sure, if education was free it would improve access to education and restore some balance. In Poland you can attend higher edu institutions on weekends and work meanwhile. It often costs you like 1.x * minimal wage per semester, thus in total like 17K PLN for bachelor/engineering degree…

> In Poland you can attend higher edu institutions on weekends and work meanwhile.

> It often costs you like 1.x * minimal wage per semester, thus in total like 17K PLN for bachelor/engineering degree (3.5 years).

It is indeed something, but why poorer people need 2-3x effort to reach the same level of education? Why are many people against things like public income and free public schools which would fix issues like this? Why do we focus on the ones exploiting the system to get "easy money" instead of focusing on people already exploited by the system which would benefit from this?

Re: Dorothy Butler Gilliam: ‘I am not a maid, I am a reporter’

#58

Post by vb234 »

DrNosferatu wrote: post #12

"Inside the newsroom some of them would say hello or nod or even speak to me but if they saw me outside the building they would pretend they didn't know me". When you experience this as an immigrant (so the ignoring party knows you have a different nationality) is it generally racism? - What do you think?

I’ve been living in the US for 21 years and whenever I experience this I assume it is racism and/or prejudice. I cannot confront them so I have no way of knowing their exact reasons for doing this. Maybe I’m just socially awkward and I don’t quite know how to play native in this country.

It didn’t bother me much until the last couple of years. I now have a young daughter who’s friends with a lot of the other kids in the neighborhood. I receive the same treatment from some of these other parents outside of the playground or outside of the school line and I can’t help but think they’re going to perpetuate this cycle in the future.

Re: Dorothy Butler Gilliam: ‘I am not a maid, I am a reporter’

#60

Post by blueflow »

hairofadog wrote: post #53
blueflow wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't "dog whistle" in this case just mental gymnastics to insinuate someone did somehow secretly say things even when neither meant to nor literally said it? Excuse my childish question, was that any different from purposefully misunderstanding your parent?

At the moment there are two other responses to my comment, and they both interpret the parent comment in completely opposite ways, so I'd offer that as support for my argument that the parent comment wasn't clear. I'm using the term "dog whistle" here to mean a comment that appears to be innocuous, ambiguous, or harmless to anyone who doesn't already understand the reference, but which in fact has meaning or acts as…

How does the second statement relate to racism?
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