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How Watches Work

fratellowatches.com

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Re: How Watches Work

#51
post #25

I recently fell into this rabbit hole. I bought a cheap automatic watch - a Seiko 5, for both practical reasons and otherwise (will work after an EMP attack/solar event, but it's also just cool as hell mechanical engineering using 200 year old technology). Then I started putting watch repair youtube videos on in the background as I did chores or wrote code. Then I started actually watching the watch repair videos. La…

Is there any mechanical watch like the Seiko 5, but thinner and hopefully not much more expensive? I have a 5 and like it, it does feel a bit chunky at times.

You can usually find used Hamiltons for less than $500. They're a solid watch with an ETA movement and a sapphire crystal.

Also, some of the microbrands are pretty interesting at the $500-$1500 range. I like many of the designs Farer is doing.

Re: How Watches Work

#52
post #26

For those who are interested in superior technology, start reading about quartz movements and the piezoelectric effect. Citizen Watch Company recently release the most accurate quartz watch ever, accurate to 1 second per year . Contrast that to the mechanical watches that Rolex—one of the best mechanical manufacturers—produces and the best they can do is an accuracy of about 1 second per day . Hundreds of times less…

That Caliber 0100 really is amazing. Looks great too. I like HAQ, but there's something about Seiko designs that just doesn't do it for me. All that said, I still think you get more for your $7,500 from a luxury mechanical watch. The accuracy of a watch matters so little to me at this point, that's it's almost gone negative; I kind of enjoy setting the time every once in a while. :D

> there's something about Seiko designs that just doesn't do it for me

Totally agree. When it comes to solar-radio the best looking I've found is this, which I bought:

https://www.seikowatches.com/jp-ja/products/seikoselection/s...

Junghans released a solar-radio version of their Max Bill:

https://www.junghans.de/en/collection/watches/junghans-max-b...

... but apparently the hands aren't self-correcting like the Seikos and Citizens and that would bug me way too much because they wouldn't line up perfectly with the markers.

> I still think you get more for your $7,500 from a luxury mechanical watch

I used to agree and then my mind changes; can't say exactly why but I sold my 2 Rolexes and haven't wanted a mech. since.

Anyhow, all my teasing of mech. fans aside, it's all frivolous fun!

Re: How Watches Work

#53
post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s how it starts! For me, my mechanical watch obsession started when I inherited my father’s mid-70s Rolex. Back then, they weren’t as insanely out of reach as they’ve become; they were a very robust watch that would Just Work for a long, long time, and which looked nice. (Remember, this was only about 15 years after Sean Connery wore a Submariner in Dr No; Rolex was even LESS upmarket in the 60s, which was a tim…

I too fell off my mechanical watch obsession when I added a smartwatch to my life. My current Fitbit keeps better time, is as waterproof as my dive watches, and give me so much more. It makes me sad sometimes, as the mechanical marvel of watches is beautiful, but in the end, I had a Seiko SKX-007 that needed some maintenance, and I was quoted $600. It was a $200 watch and they were going to swab the movement. That wa…

I think about this problem often. I think it's caused by economies of scale and is an escapee of Pandora's Box that we're not going to be able to put back. Instead, we need to think carefully about what we build and how we build it - educate consumers, regulate to price in obsolescence and recycling costs, and place greater value on long-term quality as a society - to prevent this from growing even worse.

I build industrial automation equipment, so I'm in part to blame for the problem, however, I'm also in a position to advocate for easier repair processes and more sensible assembly stackups. It's simply a fact that the six figures in initial equipment capital divided by, hopefully, a similar number of unit sales, plus the few dozen seconds of operator hands-on time per unit, always going to produce an end product which costs less than hours of diagnosis and maintenance by a local, high-skill repairman. The math simply doesn't add permit any other arrangement, no matter how standardized your tooling is, how open your repair manual is, or how efficient your aftermarket parts ecosystem is.

Repairing and maintaining something for more money than it cost to produce it puts those activities firmly in the realm of luxury goods. The better we get at producing useful things cheaply, the more we have to multiply the value of human labor, and the less it makes sense to repair cheap things with this expensive labor.

One interesting option today is that you can get an electronic watch and get access to all the internals as well:

https://open-smartwatch.github.io/

However, its operation depends on electrons and bits instead of springs and escapements, and you can see those bits moving about in PlatformIO code instead of under a magnifier.

Re: How Watches Work

#54
If anyone is interested in this I highly recommend Longitude by Dava Sobel. It's about the creation of modern timekeepers by a carpenter with no training at all in watchmaking. Brilliant guy who created something which truly changed the world.

Re: How Watches Work

#55
post #50

Mechanical watch is a mesmerizing device. Makes you wonder though, why there was so little progress around mechanical technology (not only watch specific) lately? My car can talk to me, steer, retain speed by following other vehicles, but the most amazing mechanical innovation it has is a frustratingly slow, whining seat memory function. It’s not only boring, it also relies on a century old tech. Watch are the same,…

Seiko's "spring drive" is a pretty cool innovation, though it's not purely mechanical.

I think at the very core of the issue is that mechanical watches are really art pieces at this point. Quartz watches are just cheaper and more reliable. So, if you wanting a watch for the pure utility of it all that's what you should be going for.

Re: How Watches Work

#56
post #25

I recently fell into this rabbit hole. I bought a cheap automatic watch - a Seiko 5, for both practical reasons and otherwise (will work after an EMP attack/solar event, but it's also just cool as hell mechanical engineering using 200 year old technology). Then I started putting watch repair youtube videos on in the background as I did chores or wrote code. Then I started actually watching the watch repair videos. La…

“ One interesting thing I learned, is that if you're looking for a career change, you can become a certified watch maker for free. Many of the schools are sponsored by the big name watch manufacturers, and tuition is free. It's a full time education, so you'll need enough financial runway to survive for a year or two, but you'll come out with no debt as a certified watch builder/repairperson.”

Side note: you do have to relocate yourself/your family to the school’s location.

Re: How Watches Work

#57
post #50

Mechanical watch is a mesmerizing device. Makes you wonder though, why there was so little progress around mechanical technology (not only watch specific) lately? My car can talk to me, steer, retain speed by following other vehicles, but the most amazing mechanical innovation it has is a frustratingly slow, whining seat memory function. It’s not only boring, it also relies on a century old tech. Watch are the same,…

For the most part I agree with you. I think the popular watch companies (Omega, Rolex, etc.) are resting on their laurels, but perhaps in part because that's what their consumers want. I credit Zenith and Seiko with making their more recent advances accessible to wider audiences. However, most innovation in mechanical watches, unfortunately, is currently too expensive or niche for wide diffusion. Check out companies like MB&F, Urwerk, HYT, and Ressence to see what's being done.

Re: How Watches Work

#58
post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there any mechanical watch like the Seiko 5, but thinner and hopefully not much more expensive? I have a 5 and like it, it does feel a bit chunky at times.

You can usually find used Hamiltons for less than $500. They're a solid watch with an ETA movement and a sapphire crystal. Also, some of the microbrands are pretty interesting at the $500-$1500 range. I like many of the designs Farer is doing.

Christopher Ward is another good value mechanical.

Be warned I was looking at a sub from them, and got sucked down the rabbit hole and now have a Tudor BB58 Pepsi GMT.

Tudors the feeder brand for Rolex BTW.

Re: How Watches Work

#59
post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there any mechanical watch like the Seiko 5, but thinner and hopefully not much more expensive? I have a 5 and like it, it does feel a bit chunky at times.

Seiko 5 is probably the cheapest, worthwhile mechanical watch. You can always get cheap Chinese and Russian watches as well but they will be of lesser quality and reliability than the Seiko. So to answer your question directly - probably not. But I would recommend checking out Orient watches. They have a decent set of mechanical watches of all different styles, not much more expensive than the classic Seiko 5, but de…

This is funny because Seiko has notoriously terrible quality control, from misaligned bezels and/or chapter rings to dodgy bracelets across their entire lineup, even the more expensive ones.

About Orient: they are pretty much poised to take the spot that Seiko has occupied for entry level mechanical watches, as Seiko themselves move further up market. I love the design of their Bambino and some of the OrientStar offerings but they have a few quirks I'm not fond of.

I definitely recommend also trying a hand-wound watch because the slimness is wonderful and the winding has a charm to itself as well. I have RSI issues so the lightness and slimness is certainly a big plus, combined with the fact that most vintage or vintage-inspired manual wind watches have small dials and cases too.

Re: How Watches Work

#60
post #25

I recently fell into this rabbit hole. I bought a cheap automatic watch - a Seiko 5, for both practical reasons and otherwise (will work after an EMP attack/solar event, but it's also just cool as hell mechanical engineering using 200 year old technology). Then I started putting watch repair youtube videos on in the background as I did chores or wrote code. Then I started actually watching the watch repair videos. La…

To be fair automatic watches drift substantially over time.
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