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Is Alexandra Elbakyan in real trouble this time?

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Re: Is Alexandra Elbakyan in real trouble this time?

#51

Post by unixhero »

martin1975 wrote: post #34
mrtksn wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think persistence will win this one because the moral dilemma is pretty weak here. Unlike with the software and arts, we don’t need to seek a funding model for the researchers when we take their work for free. It’s my impression that it’s a matter of adaptation before the free access becomes the norm. Therefore technical help and civil disobedience should eventually do the job. In this case, we are stealing from th…

free is a flawed concept - energy and time went into publishing each paper meaning someone paid. If the authors want to give permission, then she ought to seek it for each paper she's put on her website or seek permission from whomever owns the copyright. Otherwise it's theft. And no amount of civil disobedience can justify theft.

Well dude, information wants to be free.

Re: Is Alexandra Elbakyan in real trouble this time?

#52

Post by tbabej »

jorvi wrote: post #38
tbabej wrote: post #28

I really wonder how this is going to play out. For those who don't follow the current situation with Sci-Hub, Alexandra (the creator and likely the sole operator) of Sci-Hub shut down the part of the website ("the magical proxy") that is responsible for fetching the papers that were not previously retrieved. This was done to comply with the request of the Indian court, as described in the article. As a result, any pa…

I'm very confused, why would she ever have to comply with orders of an Indian (or indeed, US) court if she resides in Europe?

She did not have to, but she voluntarily chose to, in order to have a shot of winning this case. If she didn't comply with the court's orders, I assume the chances of winning would plummet. From the article:

> One reason is that Elbakyan believes she has a shot at winning the case, and her odds might improve if she plays by the rules. “I want the Indian court to finally support free access to science,” she said. If that happened, it would mark a significant victory for Sci-Hub, with reverberations likely beyond India. Victory remains a longshot, but Elbakyan thinks it’s worth the hassle and expense. She didn’t even bother to contest the two lawsuits in the United States.

Re: Is Alexandra Elbakyan in real trouble this time?

#53

Post by lhoff »

jorvi wrote: post #38
tbabej wrote: post #28

I really wonder how this is going to play out. For those who don't follow the current situation with Sci-Hub, Alexandra (the creator and likely the sole operator) of Sci-Hub shut down the part of the website ("the magical proxy") that is responsible for fetching the papers that were not previously retrieved. This was done to comply with the request of the Indian court, as described in the article. As a result, any pa…

I'm very confused, why would she ever have to comply with orders of an Indian (or indeed, US) court if she resides in Europe?

It's explained in the article. She thinks there is a chance to win the case in India which would be a useful publicity stunt and therefore complies with the court order.

Re: Is Alexandra Elbakyan in real trouble this time?

#54

Post by DaiPlusPlus »

failwhaleshark wrote: post #20
pmyteh wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is blocked in the UK, but only using the usual 'good enough' quasi-voluntary measures that cover the bigger ISPs. It's accessible through my more hacker-friendly home broadband. Hilariously, it's also available through JANET, the British universities' networking system. So essentially every student and researcher in the country has access from work...

The bigger question is: Why promote or condone the gating of view access to published research at all? It's not okay.

Copyright is the law of the land.

Re: Is Alexandra Elbakyan in real trouble this time?

#55

Post by baybal2 »

tbabej wrote: post #28

I really wonder how this is going to play out. For those who don't follow the current situation with Sci-Hub, Alexandra (the creator and likely the sole operator) of Sci-Hub shut down the part of the website ("the magical proxy") that is responsible for fetching the papers that were not previously retrieved. This was done to comply with the request of the Indian court, as described in the article. As a result, any pa…

Don't have much hope for the legal system on the subcontinent. Indian, Pakistani, Deshi courts are all legendary slow. It's nearly impossible to win against concerted, deliberate extension, and delay tactic against somebody who has more money to write legal letters than you.

Unlike the GB legal system, from which they branched out, they never got the reformation wave circa 1960-1970 when UK was trying to root out the most outrageous flaws of English law.

There was a now legendary legal dispute over land near either Multan, or Kohat, can't remember exactly, which began in 19th century, outlasted 6, or 7 generations, and ended just few years ago.

Re: Is Alexandra Elbakyan in real trouble this time?

#56

Post by danuker »

enriquto wrote: post #31

This is extremely infuriating. Alexandra Elbakyan has done a huge positive contribution to human civilization, even knowing that it was putting herself at personal risk. She's just 32 years old. How can we help her? Does she need money, public support, vpns in every country? Whatever she needs, mankind is indebted to her and we should help if we can. Anybody who has ever supported their research using Sci-Hub (or Lib…

> I don't know how to best support her. Any suggestions?

My guess would be to donate to her. Near the bottom of the page is a BTC address (please check it yourself):

https://sci-hub.do/ https://sci-hub.st/ https://sci-hub.se/

All the domains have the same address for me: 12PCbUDS4ho7vgSccmixKTHmq9qL2mdSns

Money (and Bitcoin is among the freest money) can be used on whatever she needs.

Re: Is Alexandra Elbakyan in real trouble this time?

#58

Post by samatman »

userbinator wrote: post #36
kergonath wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is a huge problem if you acknowledge using an illegal platform in your professional work, including for your co-authors. Almost the opposite of genius, actually.

That reminds me of a phrase I've heard in relation to file sharing and such: "if everyone runs the red light together, there is nothing to be afraid of".

Can't tell if it's intentional (some variation on Poe's law applies here), but this is a near-perfect illustration of the difference between a rivalrous (space in an intersection) and non-rivalrous (copies of a digital file) good.

I will allow that there may be some harms which can result from unlimited copying of anything you want— but they bear no resemblance to the collision of automobiles in the midst of a busy intersection.

Re: Is Alexandra Elbakyan in real trouble this time?

#59

Post by juanani »

enriquto wrote: post #31

This is extremely infuriating. Alexandra Elbakyan has done a huge positive contribution to human civilization, even knowing that it was putting herself at personal risk. She's just 32 years old. How can we help her? Does she need money, public support, vpns in every country? Whatever she needs, mankind is indebted to her and we should help if we can. Anybody who has ever supported their research using Sci-Hub (or Lib…

Yeah, there's this stain of an empire that we just can't easily scrub off the planet. Just don't worry about it and keep feeding it.

Re: Is Alexandra Elbakyan in real trouble this time?

#60

Post by krastanov »

martin1975 wrote: post #34
mrtksn wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think persistence will win this one because the moral dilemma is pretty weak here. Unlike with the software and arts, we don’t need to seek a funding model for the researchers when we take their work for free. It’s my impression that it’s a matter of adaptation before the free access becomes the norm. Therefore technical help and civil disobedience should eventually do the job. In this case, we are stealing from th…

free is a flawed concept - energy and time went into publishing each paper meaning someone paid. If the authors want to give permission, then she ought to seek it for each paper she's put on her website or seek permission from whomever owns the copyright. Otherwise it's theft. And no amount of civil disobedience can justify theft.

Some people (me included) consider "intellectual property" an oxymoron. But you do not need to go that far in the extreme to be supportive of scihub and similar entities: I am a scientist. I am paid from research grants, this is what makes it possible for me to write a paper. I am also involved in reviewing papers, but that I do for free. Then I pay a journal to store my paper (the journal did not pay the paper reviewers). Usually I even do most of the typesetting for the paper I write. Then I also pay the journal to get access to the paper.

In this story, I do not feel any guilt "stealing" from a journal that did not contribute anything but prestige to the creation of that paper (and was already paid twice for it, before I even tried to read the paper).

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