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Peloton's $3k treadmill now comes with surprise 'subscription fee'

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Re: Peloton's $3k treadmill now comes with surprise 'subscription fee'

#51

Post by monkeybutton »

jrsj wrote: post #20
wrycoder wrote: post #8

Corporations love the steady revenue of the subscription model. Look at Blackrock buying up all the housing and renting it out. The idea being that people won’t own anything except (maybe) their clothes. Well, certainly a lot less trouble for the kids when you kick off.

I don’t expect that trend to reverse itself given it benefits the people who have the most say in our politics. I’m just waiting for them to go ahead and implement a privatized social credit score too at this point.

Credit scores are already privatized so why not? Citizen and Palantir could get in on it with Equifax. They'd just need to incentivize others to do the reporting of good/bad social actions.

Re: Peloton's $3k treadmill now comes with surprise 'subscription fee'

#52

Post by tomp »

> As a reminder, under the terms of our voluntary recall, Tread+ owners can return their Tread+ for a full refund by contacting Member support

I really don’t see the problem. You don’t have to like it, you can just return it (presumably getting the purchase money back). Vote with your wallet!

Re: Peloton's $3k treadmill now comes with surprise 'subscription fee'

#53

Post by altacc »

nradov wrote: post #35
jen20 wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> subscription. It would be silly to buy a premium device who's point is to use the subscription based features and specifically intend to use it without the subscription. What if they go out of business?

I suppose that's always a risk but Peloton is in a strong financial position. They're highly unlikely to go out of business within the expected lifespan of a treadmill.

Currently performance is not a guarantee of long term outcomes, many companies have appeared to be in a strong financial position and then suddenly collapsed. As it is Peloton is currently running at a loss. You also have to factor in acquisitions, which occasionally have led to a loss of support for devices.

Re: Peloton's $3k treadmill now comes with surprise 'subscription fee'

#54

Post by danpalmer »

api wrote: post #34
wrycoder wrote: post #8

Corporations love the steady revenue of the subscription model. Look at Blackrock buying up all the housing and renting it out. The idea being that people won’t own anything except (maybe) their clothes. Well, certainly a lot less trouble for the kids when you kick off.

Investors are starting to value companies exclusively off recurring revenue. Non-subscription revenue is not even counted. If your company has $100000/month in MRR but manages to make $100M in a year, it's a $1.2M/year company.

I think investors are really starting to value companies with good economics, who can show profitable growth. Many VC-backed SV style companies over the past decade have not been like this, and I think that age is coming to an end.

Subscriptions/MRR happen to be a good way to get profitable growth, but that doesn't mean it's not possible otherwise. In fact subscriptions may be obfuscating otherwise poor economics, and I suspect that many customers are going to get subscription overload, or reach the end of nice introductory terms, and churn.

Some investors might be looking exclusively at MRR, but they are likely shortsighted. If too many value MRR and don't value other revenue, there will be plenty of valuable investments to be had in non-subscription companies and the market should rebalance.

Re: Peloton's $3k treadmill now comes with surprise 'subscription fee'

#55

Post by mehlmao »

kevstev wrote: post #36
Barrin92 wrote: post #7

I mean the entire business model of the company seems to be to depart rich people from their money in obscene ways, so that move does not seem unexpected. I generally do not understand the thought process of buying a tablet glued to a treadmill for three thousand dollars. That's like what, a decade of gym membership

These are competing with fitness studios like Soul Cycle- which charges $40+ a class after shoe rental and water. The bike is more like $2000 at least for the standard bike, not $3000. My wife bought one in November 2019, and both joined the "century club" (100 rides) by the middle of 2020 and she takes the Yoga classes as well and I have done a few strength classes- its not just about the bike. We had never previous…

The treadmill costs $2,495 and the upgraded version is $4,295.

Re: Peloton's $3k treadmill now comes with surprise 'subscription fee'

#56

Post by jasode »

kevstev wrote: post #36
Barrin92 wrote: post #7

I mean the entire business model of the company seems to be to depart rich people from their money in obscene ways, so that move does not seem unexpected. I generally do not understand the thought process of buying a tablet glued to a treadmill for three thousand dollars. That's like what, a decade of gym membership

These are competing with fitness studios like Soul Cycle- which charges $40+ a class after shoe rental and water. The bike is more like $2000 at least for the standard bike, not $3000. My wife bought one in November 2019, and both joined the "century club" (100 rides) by the middle of 2020 and she takes the Yoga classes as well and I have done a few strength classes- its not just about the bike. We had never previous…

>I hate group fitness and cycle studios, and am currently on a 65+ week streak on Peloton. The value is there for me,

I understand the value proposition of an internet-connected "virtual class" for motivation, competitive pacing, social gaming, etc but my limited research showed that one can get these benefits with just the Peloton app[1] (the software) without buying the hardware (Peloton branded bike/treadmill).

The big disadvantage with the whole Peloton hardware+software integrated package is them changing the Terms of Service on the customer at any time to raise prices. (E.g. this thread's topic of abruptly removing treadmill's "Just Run" $0 cost option.)

Is the DIY option with your own bike/treadmill with an iPad running the Peloton app too awkward that it makes the integrated Peloton the better value? Or are buyers simply not aware of the options?

[1] https://apps.apple.com/app/apple-store/id792750948

Re: Peloton's $3k treadmill now comes with surprise 'subscription fee'

#57

Post by throwaway0a5e »

jerf wrote: post #23

'The company has cited "safety and well-being" as a reason for introducing the membership fee.' I've noticed the "fake because" lately seems to be getting more and more brazen from corporations. This is about the third or fourth "for your safety and convenience we're helping ourselves to more of your money" I've seen in the last couple months, and unfortunately all the other ones I've seen are for products or service…

Safety is a modern day god. Corporations are invoking its name to justify whatever they want the same way a medieval lord would invoke god in their justification for sending a dozen dudes to beat someone up.

"For your safety you need to swipe your credit card before your riding lawnmower will go into reverse."

edit: 'the' vs 'a', modern society's worship of abstract concepts is more akin to ancient polytheistic societies than medieval Christianity.

Re: Peloton's $3k treadmill now comes with surprise 'subscription fee'

#58

Post by mannykannot »

Spivak wrote: post #44
sys_64738 wrote: post #26

How can a lump of hardware require a subscription to work? I've been in a coma for 20 years.

Because you're not really buying the hardware. Like you are in the sense that the price of the bike covers the hardware cost, and that you own the hunk of metal and plastic so that you're responsible for maintaining it and fixing/replacing it if you break it and it's transferable if you ever want to sell it. But like an iPhone you're buying a client to a larger service hosted by Peleton -- that's their whole business…

> Because you're not really buying the hardware.

Apparently, what you are buying is an obligation to buy a recurring subscription.

The genius in getting people to spend a lot up front to so burden themselves is that the more they pay, the less likely they are to walk away from it.

Re: Peloton's $3k treadmill now comes with surprise 'subscription fee'

#60

Post by anthonygd »

ErikVandeWater wrote: post #9
Barrin92 wrote: post #7

I mean the entire business model of the company seems to be to depart rich people from their money in obscene ways, so that move does not seem unexpected. I generally do not understand the thought process of buying a tablet glued to a treadmill for three thousand dollars. That's like what, a decade of gym membership

I generally agree. But owners would argue that a $3k treadmill that's used consistently is a much better value than a $500 treadmill that's used only its first month of ownership. I'd add their are things that are much more expensive people spend money on that are much less likely to result in happiness. Buying a fast-depreciating Mercedes or BMW for example.

It's just important that people figure out what makes them happy, and what they're buying.

I have no issue spending $60k+ on a car because I like to drive and a nice car makes me happy every time I get in. There is no way I'd buy a Peloton though: I absolutely hate all fitness classes. I'd rather spend $3k on dumb equipment than $1k on "smart" equipment with classes.

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