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DenoDB

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Re: DenoDB

#51

Post by alexose »

Osiris wrote: post #12

I hate ORMs with the fury of a thousand suns. The problem is that I know SQL but now I have to spend a bunch of time trying to figure out how to convert SQL into ORM X just so it can convert it back to inefficient SQL. SQL mostly translates between various databases but ORMs are unique and you have to learn a new API for each one. I'm on a project using TypeORM and it has been fantastic at helping developers on my te…

I'm with you. ORMs feel like _exactly_ the wrong place to abstract. In my experience, database calls always end up being the thing you want the most control over.

Re: DenoDB

#53

Post by mirekrusin »

Personally I prefer functional combinators like interfaces [0]. Js/ts have tagged templates which enhances those type of interfaces a lot. It gives access to full set of functionality of underlying database, not just common denominator of all used. It allows arbitrary compositions etc.

[0] https://github.com/appliedblockchain/tsql/

Re: DenoDB

#54

Post by mirekrusin »

bhj wrote: post #22
hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're being downvoted, but I completely agree. If you are on Node and Postgres I highly recommend using slonik - it makes it easy to just write SQL but at the same time makes it almost impossible to have mistakes like SQL injections: https://gajus.medium.com/stop-using-knex-js-and-earn-30-bf41... https://github.com/gajus/slonik

Along similar lines but more simple/agnostic, check out node-sql-template-strings[0] or sqlate[1]. [0]: https://github.com/felixfbecker/node-sql-template-strings [1]: https://github.com/moll/js-sqlate

for mssql https://github.com/appliedblockchain/tsql/

Re: DenoDB

#55

Post by mirekrusin »

KingMachiavelli wrote: post #40
Osiris wrote: post #12

I hate ORMs with the fury of a thousand suns. The problem is that I know SQL but now I have to spend a bunch of time trying to figure out how to convert SQL into ORM X just so it can convert it back to inefficient SQL. SQL mostly translates between various databases but ORMs are unique and you have to learn a new API for each one. I'm on a project using TypeORM and it has been fantastic at helping developers on my te…

What's the alternative? Are you saying it's better to use raw SQL or to use your own home grown convenience functions for creating tables, selecting rows, etc.? And once you have the data from the SQL database are you keeping it just in arrays/dictionaries? Or should it at least be mapped to a class structure? As someone dealing with a bespoke SQL schema and mix of in-house SQL translation layers for different DBs, w…

Example of alternative https://observablehq.com/@mirek/tsql-examples

Re: DenoDB

#56

Post by 4lejandrito »

KingMachiavelli wrote: post #40
Osiris wrote: post #12

I hate ORMs with the fury of a thousand suns. The problem is that I know SQL but now I have to spend a bunch of time trying to figure out how to convert SQL into ORM X just so it can convert it back to inefficient SQL. SQL mostly translates between various databases but ORMs are unique and you have to learn a new API for each one. I'm on a project using TypeORM and it has been fantastic at helping developers on my te…

What's the alternative? Are you saying it's better to use raw SQL or to use your own home grown convenience functions for creating tables, selecting rows, etc.? And once you have the data from the SQL database are you keeping it just in arrays/dictionaries? Or should it at least be mapped to a class structure? As someone dealing with a bespoke SQL schema and mix of in-house SQL translation layers for different DBs, w…

I’ve been using https://prisma.io lately and I love it. It builds a Db client right from your db schema including Typescript typings.

I don’t consider it an ORM in the classical sense. I see it more as a query builder.

Re: DenoDB

#57

Post by girvo »

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #14
Osiris wrote: post #12

I hate ORMs with the fury of a thousand suns. The problem is that I know SQL but now I have to spend a bunch of time trying to figure out how to convert SQL into ORM X just so it can convert it back to inefficient SQL. SQL mostly translates between various databases but ORMs are unique and you have to learn a new API for each one. I'm on a project using TypeORM and it has been fantastic at helping developers on my te…

You're being downvoted, but I completely agree. If you are on Node and Postgres I highly recommend using slonik - it makes it easy to just write SQL but at the same time makes it almost impossible to have mistakes like SQL injections: https://gajus.medium.com/stop-using-knex-js-and-earn-30-bf41... https://github.com/gajus/slonik

> it makes it easy to just write SQL but at the same time makes it almost impossible to have mistakes like SQL injections

While I think this is totally the way to go, it is kind of amusing that PHP's PDO system was the "right" way to go all along in some ways

Re: DenoDB

#58

Post by girvo »

4lejandrito wrote: post #56
KingMachiavelli wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's the alternative? Are you saying it's better to use raw SQL or to use your own home grown convenience functions for creating tables, selecting rows, etc.? And once you have the data from the SQL database are you keeping it just in arrays/dictionaries? Or should it at least be mapped to a class structure? As someone dealing with a bespoke SQL schema and mix of in-house SQL translation layers for different DBs, w…

I’ve been using https://prisma.io lately and I love it. It builds a Db client right from your db schema including Typescript typings. I don’t consider it an ORM in the classical sense. I see it more as a query builder.

Prisma looks great as someone who lives in Typescript land. Have you been using it "in anger", are there any limitations you've run into that its worth keeping in mind? I'm going to give it a shot on my personal project.

Re: DenoDB

#59

Post by phplovesong »

During my years as a dev i have really started to dislike ORMs. They always fail in the end. SQL is universal, and transfers between languages and tech fields. This is why im pro-sql, and always try to avoid unnecessary abstractions.

I have actually went back to writing pure SQL in files, and using those as params for whatever db engine i use, this makes it even possible to reuse the code in other projects (even its unlikely that you can use the exact same query, but just as a "it would work" in theory).

For node based projects i have used and would probably still choose pg-promise (https://github.com/vitaly-t/pg-promise).

Re: DenoDB

#60

Post by redact207 »

Osiris wrote: post #12

I hate ORMs with the fury of a thousand suns. The problem is that I know SQL but now I have to spend a bunch of time trying to figure out how to convert SQL into ORM X just so it can convert it back to inefficient SQL. SQL mostly translates between various databases but ORMs are unique and you have to learn a new API for each one. I'm on a project using TypeORM and it has been fantastic at helping developers on my te…

I find people hate/are ok with ORMs based on how they're used.

If you're using it to ad-hoc query your db then it's understandable you'll hate it - a leaky and poor abstraction over sql. Probably a bad fit.

Projects where I've seen it work well is when most of the logic is in the app with per row/per aggregate changes. In these apps it's only used for the "object relational mapping" side of things - ie to marshal types to/from db rows.

I've never found auto-migrations in ORMs good for anything less than a 1 day project - it's a world of hurt.

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