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Recovering “lost” treasure-filled floppy discs with an oscilloscope

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Re: Recovering “lost” treasure-filled floppy discs with an oscilloscope

#51

Oh wow, I did not realize that floppy discs used the same exact encoding that was used on tape drives of the era, e.g. the TI-99/4A [1]. The wave file in the article is the exact same sound I'd listen to as a child, loading programs from cassettes. Total coincidence -- I recently have been recovering games from my old TI-99/4A cassettes, also using an oscilloscope (the same model in fact; for no particularly good rea…

> the same model in fact It could only be Rigol or Siglent. Fascinating though. I know how slow floppies are, but I wouldn't have imagined an oscilloscope to have the necessary resolution.

Siglent SDS 1104X-E, same as in one of the photos.

In my case, the data was coming from cassette tapes, so the oscilloscope was absolutely overkill in terms of raw bandwidth by 3 orders of magnitude. However I was operating at its memory limit of 14 MSa (megasamples)... running at a sampling rate of 20 kSa/s, I had barely enough memory to grab the full 10 minutes of each tape side.

Its vertical resolution (8 bits) I was a little worried about, but the dynamic range of Differential Manchester/FM is so low it turned out to be a nonissue. Certainly the quantization noise is comparable to the noise floor of the basic-quality cassettes that my data was on.

Re: Recovering “lost” treasure-filled floppy discs with an oscilloscope

#52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spelling_of_disc : By the 20th century, the "k" spelling was more popular in the United States, while the "c" variant was preferred in the UK. Consequently, in computer terminology today it is common for the "k" word to refer mainly to magnetic storage devices (particularly in British English, where the term disk is sometimes regarded as a contraction of diskette, a much later word…

And talking of interesting spelling, it's "Philips", not "Phillips".

that's my own special typo :)

Re: Recovering “lost” treasure-filled floppy discs with an oscilloscope

#53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I once wrote some code to recover degraded CD/DVD(+/-R) sectors by disabling the ECC of the drive How did you do this? Is there some SCSI/ATAPI command for this?

I found out how to use a vendor-specific command to read the raw data from the buffer of the drive before descrambling and ECC. Look up the "FriiDump" project for some more background information. I then patched the firmware in memory (that took a lot of work...) to cause regular read commands to return the raw data. (Contrary to some of the other comments in this thread, the drive was actually an LG.)

Wow! It does sound extremely painful haha. Thanks for sharing, that's pretty useful info.

Re: Recovering “lost” treasure-filled floppy discs with an oscilloscope

#54
post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's just FM, on floppies known as "single density" mode: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frequency_modulation The common IBM PC and related formats use "double density" MFM: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modified_frequency_modulation

Interesting - I should really try to find the specifics on how AmigaOS stored its data. I'm guessing it's not MFM as the optional driver slash virtual device for reading IBM floppies required an MFM driver (thus implying MFM is not in use for standard AOS floppies). [edit] it actually IS mfm after all https://wiki.amigaos.net/wiki/Amiga_Floppy_Boot_Process_and_...

The Amiga floppy controller hardware just DMAs the bits to / from RAM. MFM encoding and decoding is implemented in the software trackdisk.device by using the blitter.

Re: Recovering “lost” treasure-filled floppy discs with an oscilloscope

#55

I'd be interested to see the results of mounting a much smaller head (eg. a hard drive head) to the floppy drive, and then creating a full 2D image of the disk surface magnetics. That should be able to read disks where the disk surface has stretched or warped, and the tracks are no longer perfectly circular. I think there's also a reasonable chance such a method could also be used to recover data on a disc that has b…

You mean something like this?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Floppy_disk#/media/File:Visual...

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