Game developers sharing their salaries on Twitter • Hacker News Board

Re: Game developers sharing their salaries on Twitter

#51

Post by foobarian » Mon, May 10, 2021, 7:31 PM UTC

bpodgursky wrote: post #16

f430 wrote: post #2

What is it about game development field that makes it so labor intensive with consistent overtimes? I tried to make a simple FPS game and it was astounding how much work was involved. Took 6 month of learning Unreal and Unity and gave up with a functioning prototype. Took 4 months of back and forth with Steam to list my game. Even harder trying to make money off it. I'm just in awe of Roblox, Minecraft, Fall Guy and…

I know it sounds trite, but it really is supply and demand. So so so many developers want to build games. The market for developers making things that _aren't_ games is red-hot. But because they REALLY want to develop games, game companies can use them to their limit for low pay.

The game industry has the unique advantage that entry level developers spend their preceding 10-15 years playing games and building up a desire to make them. Imagine if kids had Enterprise Software consoles and played with Jira tickets on them. The rest of the industry would be swimming in applicants :-)

Re: Game developers sharing their salaries on Twitter

#52

Post by veilrap » Mon, May 10, 2021, 7:31 PM UTC

darth_avocado wrote: post #27

bluescrn wrote: post #10

The massive gap between UK and US gamedev salaries seems to keep getting larger :(

US cost of living is ridiculous. You shouldn't just compare two numbers one to one. 150k in California is basically just scraping by.

The cost of living in California IS high. But $150k is much better than just scraping by. Assuming 40% tax rate, and a montly rent of $3000, that's $54,000 remaining with the two biggest expenses already accounted for.

Re: Game developers sharing their salaries on Twitter

#53

Post by ttul » Mon, May 10, 2021, 7:31 PM UTC

ashtonkem wrote: post #42

My standard advice to every graduate CS student is to stay the hell away from professional video game development. If you want to make games, turn it into a hobby instead.

I dunno. My friend is making $250K working for Roblox. He’s 15yrs into his career - all game dev. Doesn’t seem too bad.

Re: Game developers sharing their salaries on Twitter

#54

Post by Jommi » Mon, May 10, 2021, 7:31 PM UTC

gpm wrote: post #36

Raed667 wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm struggling with this, I can't find a formula to translate US salaries to European ones (UK, FR, DE, mainly). On the one hand in the US if you save a lot, you can retire early and move somewhere cheap. On the other hand in Europe a lot of things are covered for you without having to deduct them from the salary. If anyone has researched this subject I'd love some links.

It seems like you should just be comparing pre-tax salary converted into the same currency?

Pre-tax doesnt include: - Childcare - Full healthcare expenses - Transportation - Security

Re: Game developers sharing their salaries on Twitter

#55

Post by mbesto » Mon, May 10, 2021, 7:31 PM UTC

f430 wrote: post #2

What is it about game development field that makes it so labor intensive with consistent overtimes? I tried to make a simple FPS game and it was astounding how much work was involved. Took 6 month of learning Unreal and Unity and gave up with a functioning prototype. Took 4 months of back and forth with Steam to list my game. Even harder trying to make money off it. I'm just in awe of Roblox, Minecraft, Fall Guy and…

> with consistent overtimes?

One thing I've noticed about businesses that operate in the arts & entertainment space - people who do a lot of the labor have personal passions for their industry and are subsequently are willing to deal with employer abuses.

Re: Game developers sharing their salaries on Twitter

#56

Post by gambiting » Mon, May 10, 2021, 7:32 PM UTC

ngngngng wrote: post #37

Nursie wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t think it’s just games! UK software dev money is terrible, outside of contracting.

Why in the world is software money so terrible in the UK? I always look up salaries and cost of living when traveling and the UK was one of the more surprising instances of that. It seems like the only way to live comfortably in London is in finance.

London skews all comparisons though, literally move to any other city in the UK and you'll see rents drop by 50% if not 75% for not a lot less pay in salaries. Try Manchester or Edinburgh, you'll get decent pay and rent a nice place for affordable money.

Re: Game developers sharing their salaries on Twitter

#57

Post by bidirectional » Mon, May 10, 2021, 7:32 PM UTC

node-bayarea wrote: post #23

If my software is online and the company can make profit from across the world, why should I get paid locally?

Surely this line of thinking leads to lower salaries? Silicon Valley salaries are purely a function of the local labour market, Facebook still pays Oxford graduates in (insanely expensive) London a fraction of what they would be earning in the US.

Re: Game developers sharing their salaries on Twitter

#58

Post by dbish » Mon, May 10, 2021, 7:32 PM UTC

ttul wrote: post #53

ashtonkem wrote: post #42

My standard advice to every graduate CS student is to stay the hell away from professional video game development. If you want to make games, turn it into a hobby instead.

I dunno. My friend is making $250K working for Roblox. He’s 15yrs into his career - all game dev. Doesn’t seem too bad.

15 years in software could get you a lot more outside game dev

Re: Game developers sharing their salaries on Twitter

#59

Post by SketchySeaBeast » Mon, May 10, 2021, 7:32 PM UTC

minimuffins wrote: post #35

sldksk wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most unions in the US are in fact only made up of skilled workers. Your point is just wrong.

I think you'll have a hard time sourcing that claim.

https://www.investopedia.com/articles/personal-finance/07301...

The top 5 appear to be teachers, steelworkers, public service workers, autoworkers, and electrical workers. How many of these would you describe as "unskilled"?

Re: Game developers sharing their salaries on Twitter

#60

Post by _delirium » Mon, May 10, 2021, 7:33 PM UTC

Raed667 wrote: post #31

bluescrn wrote: post #10

The massive gap between UK and US gamedev salaries seems to keep getting larger :(

I'm struggling with this, I can't find a formula to translate US salaries to European ones (UK, FR, DE, mainly). On the one hand in the US if you save a lot, you can retire early and move somewhere cheap. On the other hand in Europe a lot of things are covered for you without having to deduct them from the salary. If anyone has researched this subject I'd love some links.

It's pretty complicated in general. For example, if you have kids, the European advantage tends to be bigger than if you don't (depending on which country, this may include subsidized daycare, cheaper or free college tuition, cheaper or free healthcare, etc.).

In my particular case, when moving from the UK to the US, my estimate is that the "headline" salary number for the US offer I got overstated my pay by about 30% when comparing on a "like for like" basis with the UK salary. It was still a pay increase, but not by as much as you would think from just looking at the two salary numbers.

The main differences were: 1) my UK taxes were lower, 2) the UK job made pension contributions worth about 18% of salary, while the US one didn't, and 3) the US job deducts about 5% of my salary for health insurance premiums.