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SBA executives ‘beyond doubt’ that teleworking employees are more productive

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Re: SBA executives ‘beyond doubt’ that teleworking employees are more productive

#51

Post by thelean12 »

dleslie wrote: post #32
thelean12 wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your description of ideal working conditions sounds so robotic to me. Schedule everything! No off the cuff conversations! Screw the human desire for socializing, we've got shit to do! Right now my team is comprised of no one that I've met in person. I feel absolutely no connection to them and feel so incredibly disconnected from my work. Like I've been playing the same video game for 8 hours a day for a year and noth…

We actively talk over slack. There's a #random channel, a #stonks channel, et al. There's plenty of banter. But _anyone_ can mute those and focus. I _cannot_ mute a coworker talking loudly next to my desk.

> I _cannot_ mute a coworker talking loudly next to my desk.

Maybe my team was more respectful. Any prolonged conversation can and was taken to a conference room or common area.

I also wear noise canceling headphones most of the day, and find the general muted drone of office noises nice. People listen to recorded audio of cafes and stuff, it's basically the same for me.

But to be clear: I'm not saying everyone should have the same preferences as me. I'm just letting my voice and concerns be heard, since I've heard plenty of people go on about how they think WFH/remote work is better.

Re: SBA executives ‘beyond doubt’ that teleworking employees are more productive

#52

Post by walshemj »

VectorLock wrote: post #18
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #2

The SBA is referring specifically to their own employees doing SBA work, not necessarily telework in general. Interestingly, they attribute the additional productivity to the fact that their telework employees are simply working more hours: > “It doesn’t matter to me where your eight-, 10-, 12-hour day is, but as long as we’re getting coverage from that perspective,” Rivera said. > While some federal managers have ex…

I'm okay with spending the X% percent of hours I would be commuting doing productive work, and double-okay with my employer reaping the productivity benefits from it.

Why - its not like your getting paid for it.

Re: SBA executives ‘beyond doubt’ that teleworking employees are more productive

#53

Post by VectorLock »

gnicholas wrote: post #26
VectorLock wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm okay with spending the X% percent of hours I would be commuting doing productive work, and double-okay with my employer reaping the productivity benefits from it.

People who have an unenjoyable commute, like stop-and-go-traffic, probably feel this way. But people who commute while exercising (bicycle riders) or consume books/podcasts/news while commuting probably wouldn't be so inclined.

I'd say people who have an "enjoyable" commute is likely in the vanishing minority. And then they can simply reproduce their commute in their leisure time.

Re: SBA executives ‘beyond doubt’ that teleworking employees are more productive

#54

Post by danans »

awillen wrote: post #49

I don't understand why we can't just all agree that some people are more productive at home and others are not. It depends on personality, type of role and type of business. We're literally talking about hundreds of millions of people here, so pretty much any universal statement is going to be wrong.

Because, at least in tech, many who insist that one or the other are absolutely superior are motivated by unstated resentments against higher cost of living near their employers' offices, or sometimes by cultural or political aversion to the majority culture in those areas.

There's nothing wrong with either of those motivations, but often the WFH versus office debate is a smoke screen for one of them.

Re: SBA executives ‘beyond doubt’ that teleworking employees are more productive

#55

Post by dleslie »

thelean12 wrote: post #51
dleslie wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We actively talk over slack. There's a #random channel, a #stonks channel, et al. There's plenty of banter. But _anyone_ can mute those and focus. I _cannot_ mute a coworker talking loudly next to my desk.

> I _cannot_ mute a coworker talking loudly next to my desk. Maybe my team was more respectful. Any prolonged conversation can and was taken to a conference room or common area. I also wear noise canceling headphones most of the day, and find the general muted drone of office noises nice. People listen to recorded audio of cafes and stuff, it's basically the same for me. But to be clear: I'm not saying everyone shoul…

Noise cancelling isn't enough. If I know someone is discussing topics important to my deliverables then I have to pay attention.

Re: SBA executives ‘beyond doubt’ that teleworking employees are more productive

#56

Post by dleslie »

heavyset_go wrote: post #46
dleslie wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you ever tried to have a party at two locations? It doesn't work.

Using this logic, employers' offices and branches in other cities shouldn't work either, but they do. Remote and hybrid companies also show that they work, too.

Separate offices tend to have separate clients and/or separate products.

Re: SBA executives ‘beyond doubt’ that teleworking employees are more productive

#57

Post by zhengyi13 »

ping_pong wrote: post #19

Both Yahoo and IBM rolled back their very flexible WFH strategies. I don't think super flexible WFH is a lasting trend, because it's obvious that is doesn't work for most of the people. I personally love WFH and I know a lot of HN do too, but I think human nature is that it probably won't work very well for most companies.

From what I recall of talking to a couple Yahoo employees at the time, they felt that Yahoo had a significant issue with tracking/accountability that was a large driver in the decision to roll those policies back and demand butts in seats.

Re: SBA executives ‘beyond doubt’ that teleworking employees are more productive

#58

Post by toxik »

newusr415 wrote: post #45
dleslie wrote: post #9

I am _ridiculously_ more productive at home. When I hear folks complain about the pains of working from home, what I often hear are their stories about how they were needlessly disruptive to their coworkers. Having impromptu hallway meetings mean that your peers, and subordinates, must keep an ear open for such events should they risk being left out of important decision making processes. Having watercooler conversat…

I advocated for remote work pretty aggressively. I've been doing it now for about a year due to the pandemic, with the option of doing it permanently at my current employer. I'm not sure I'm that enthusiastic about it anymore. Life just seems a lot more boring to me. Every day is the same and it's become incredibly repetitive. I've been getting somewhat depressed about having this repetitive lifestyle for the next N…

Let it be said:

The pandemic is a poor facsimile of remote work. Iow, working from home to quarantine is fundamentally not the same as remote work.

In remote work, you can grab lunch with a friend, have a beer after work, or meet your grandparents. These things matter.

Re: SBA executives ‘beyond doubt’ that teleworking employees are more productive

#59

Post by whateveracct »

thelean12 wrote: post #24
dleslie wrote: post #9

I am _ridiculously_ more productive at home. When I hear folks complain about the pains of working from home, what I often hear are their stories about how they were needlessly disruptive to their coworkers. Having impromptu hallway meetings mean that your peers, and subordinates, must keep an ear open for such events should they risk being left out of important decision making processes. Having watercooler conversat…

Your description of ideal working conditions sounds so robotic to me. Schedule everything! No off the cuff conversations! Screw the human desire for socializing, we've got shit to do! Right now my team is comprised of no one that I've met in person. I feel absolutely no connection to them and feel so incredibly disconnected from my work. Like I've been playing the same video game for 8 hours a day for a year and noth…

I love not having a connection to my coworkers personally. I have some connection to the handful of people I directly collaborate with (like people who work on the same codebase), but that's it. And those interactions are far from daily, but enough that I have casual rapport. Nothing meaningful or personal required, but still a good working relationship.

Re: SBA executives ‘beyond doubt’ that teleworking employees are more productive

#60

Post by walshemj »

sokoloff wrote: post #6
Someone1234 wrote: post #3

Does it matter though? I mean that literally, does actual data matter? The data in support of telecommuting has been around for years if you want to find it, heck you even pay employees less in some circumstances as they can live in lower COL areas (plus cost savings in fewer offices/smaller offices/rental instead of ownership/etc). But the reality is that a certain type of employee rises through the ranks: Those who…

It was a world-wide pre/post test to be sure. I think that most companies will be better off to go back into the offices because the alternative is to carefully think through the work and write a lot of things down. People would rather talk than write, on average.

Trying to get some people to understand adding version numbers to filenames instead of

tpsreport-final-final-iralymenit-fianly-freds-changes.xlst

Seems to be really hard - let alone doing minutes and action points correctly

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