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TikTok and the network effects of creativity

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Re: TikTok and the network effects of creativity

#51

Post by rrdharan »

tomerico wrote: post #29

The most disruptive part of Tiktok is how it managed to dramatically reduce the "rich gets richer" effect of entertainment platforms. If you upload a video, TikTok will show it to other users even if it's your first. This allows them to assess it and progressively grow its audience. On YouTube and Instagram you'd have to rely on search traffic or external sources to build up your audience and get recommended (except…

This always sounded pretty unequal to me.. has it stopped?

https://theintercept.com/2020/03/16/tiktok-app-moderators-us...

Re: TikTok and the network effects of creativity

#52

Post by tp3 »

justwalt wrote: post #50
tp3 wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I watch TikTok and watch their videos because my audience is just me. And because they are just me. I don't want to watch anyone else because I believe it's not worth watching them. But they are my audience. That's all I want. And they are my audience. And I feel like I should be making sure that they feel that way for me. And they are making damn sure that it is worth watching. When I think of this "I believe this t…

GPT3?

Do you mean the model? What about it?

Re: TikTok and the network effects of creativity

#53

Post by knolax »

psyc wrote: post #25
knolax wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The extreme majority of humans are mimics, they essentially never create or do anything creative or original. They are incapable of that (cue the outrage at such a statement, even though it's true). Of course people are going to be outraged over the statement. You're playing a semantic game where you came up with your own definition of creativity that excludes what most people do, and then not actually defining it…

Every dictionary definition of the word I’m looking at right now includes the words “original”, “originality”, or “not imitated.” I think the word “prolific” applies to what TikTok facilitates, much more than the word “creative.” And personally I find the amount of word for word and beat for beat mimicry on the app maddening.

> Every dictionary definition of the word I’m looking at right now includes the words “original”, “originality”, or “not imitated.”

Citing dictionary definitions just shifts your argument from one word whose meaning you didn't define to another word whose meaning you haven't defined. Is the Mona Lisa original? It's not the first oil painting, nor the first portrait, nor even the first painting of an Italian noblewoman made in the renaissance style. Yet it's commonly considered to be creative despite being imitative and unoriginal in all those previously mentioned aspects. What definition of original can you then make that simultaneously includes the Mona Lisa, is mutually exclusive with any imitation, and excludes the "majority of humans".

Re: TikTok and the network effects of creativity

#55

Post by cma »

tomerico wrote: post #29

The most disruptive part of Tiktok is how it managed to dramatically reduce the "rich gets richer" effect of entertainment platforms. If you upload a video, TikTok will show it to other users even if it's your first. This allows them to assess it and progressively grow its audience. On YouTube and Instagram you'd have to rely on search traffic or external sources to build up your audience and get recommended (except…

When I visit TikTok without logging in I see a side bar recommending Will Smith, Gordon Ramsey, Kevin Hart, Selena Gomez, and SnoopDogg.

They may surface other stuff better than other platforms, but they definitely have the same "rich gets richer" stuff in the default landing page too.

Re: TikTok and the network effects of creativity

#56

Post by awooooo56709 »

rrdharan wrote: post #51
tomerico wrote: post #29

The most disruptive part of Tiktok is how it managed to dramatically reduce the "rich gets richer" effect of entertainment platforms. If you upload a video, TikTok will show it to other users even if it's your first. This allows them to assess it and progressively grow its audience. On YouTube and Instagram you'd have to rely on search traffic or external sources to build up your audience and get recommended (except…

This always sounded pretty unequal to me.. has it stopped? https://theintercept.com/2020/03/16/tiktok-app-moderators-us...

If you read the actual "leak" it's obviously that the article is twisting words. It suppresses videos where the ugliness of a person is the main focus, not videos with ugly people. That's a perfectly legitimate anti-bullying tactic. Ugly people don't make videos focusing on their ugliness, people mocking ugly people do. It doesn't say anything about censoring poor people, just videos where the environment is dilapidated. Saying that it leads to censoring poor people is a big logical leap. Most of the rest of the article is just filler that adds nothing to the central thesis. Classic "journalism".

Re: TikTok and the network effects of creativity

#57

Post by _nothing »

justwalt wrote: post #50
tp3 wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I watch TikTok and watch their videos because my audience is just me. And because they are just me. I don't want to watch anyone else because I believe it's not worth watching them. But they are my audience. That's all I want. And they are my audience. And I feel like I should be making sure that they feel that way for me. And they are making damn sure that it is worth watching. When I think of this "I believe this t…

GPT3?

That's also my suspicion. Their other comments seem equally unintelligible to me. Could also be someone for whom English isn't their first language, but I do suspect I'm going to find this account on some GPT-3 writeup in a few months time.

Re: TikTok and the network effects of creativity

#58

Post by tp3 »

_nothing wrote: post #57
justwalt wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

GPT3?

That's also my suspicion. Their other comments seem equally unintelligible to me. Could also be someone for whom English isn't their first language, but I do suspect I'm going to find this account on some GPT-3 writeup in a few months time.

I am not an GPT-3 robot and I do not even having access to API or model while I am on the wait listing. I do not speak of native ENglish and maybe no great writer. Please excuse this deficiency.

Re: TikTok and the network effects of creativity

#59

Post by feralimal »

tomerico wrote: post #29

The most disruptive part of Tiktok is how it managed to dramatically reduce the "rich gets richer" effect of entertainment platforms. If you upload a video, TikTok will show it to other users even if it's your first. This allows them to assess it and progressively grow its audience. On YouTube and Instagram you'd have to rely on search traffic or external sources to build up your audience and get recommended (except…

Serious question - if we are being recommended anything to watch, shouldn't we have some sort of idea of what the algorithm does?

I would love to see advocates for openness in algorithms, as we have advocates for open source software. We have no idea what filters are applied by tiktok, youtube, etc. If I knew what they were, would I agree with them?

Questions that arise for me, are:

* What are the value judgements behind the algorithmic recommendations?

* Is it ok for corporations to entrain their users with specific content, if that it is not based on a neutral algorithm?

* There is surely interest on the part of corporations to promote or constrain certain ideas, that do not suit them. These would play out in the political, economic, legal domains. If the algorithm does not let you know, this would be a lie by omission, and therefore immoral IMO.

Etc.

I don't think I have seen any discussion on this, albeit I think it is a hugely important issue.

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