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Each Decade That Passes, Fewer People Report Knowing How to Drive Stick Shifts

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Re: Each Decade That Passes, Fewer People Report Knowing How to Drive Stick Shifts

#51

Post by macintux »

falcolas wrote: post #50
macintux wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“Most budget lines” (which I’m skeptical is accurate) is different from “broadly available”, but I suppose lacking any precise definitions of either phrase it’s not a useful argument.

> which I’m skeptical is accurate Feel free to look for yourself. They list it under "powertrain" in the specs pages. > is different from “broadly available”, FWIW, my definition boils down to: available from most manufacturers, in the major form factors (truck, SUV, sedan, compact, sport).

Well, as one counter-example, because there's far too much data to dig out of the aether, as far as I can tell there are only two manufacturers selling manual pickups: Jeep and Toyota.

No Chevy, Dodge, GMC, Ford. That's just one huge gap.

Update: also, if you extend that to SUVs, one of the hottest markets, I think the only model you add is the Ford Bronco.

So there are no entry-level pickups or SUVs as manuals. For CUVs you could probably add Kia Soul and Mazda, but not much else.

Re: Each Decade That Passes, Fewer People Report Knowing How to Drive Stick Shifts

#52

Post by macintux »

letitbeirie wrote: post #39
OldHand2018 wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well if you’re ever in the Detroit area, stop by Ford’s Greenfield Village and they’ll happily give you rides in their Model T fleet. If you want to sit up front and ask questions, they’ll be glad to show you how to drive it (but not let you drive it - you need to get your own).

Top Gear did a piece a while back on car controls and the Model T did not look easy or intuitive to drive. It looked shockingly capable off-road though, which I guess makes sense if you think about what counted for a road in the 1910s.

> which I guess makes sense if you think about what counted for a road in the 1910s.

Speaking of, there's a good book (although I admit I've barely started) called "American Road" by Pete Davies which draws a vivid picture of what roads were like and the politics involved in even deciding whether government should be involved in road building.

Its primary goal is describing a military motor train that crossed the country in 1919 (and may well have been a key opportunity that kept Eisenhower from leaving the military...history has some fascinating turning points).

Re: Each Decade That Passes, Fewer People Report Knowing How to Drive Stick Shifts

#53

Post by eesmith »

OldHand2018 wrote: post #34
eesmith wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Each decade that passes, fewer people report knowing how to start an engine with a hand crank. I've seen my uncle do it. He said you don't grip it with your hand, else you might break your arm should the motor jerk the crank away. Never did it myself. Fewer people know how to use carbide lamps too.

Well if you’re ever in the Detroit area, stop by Ford’s Greenfield Village and they’ll happily give you rides in their Model T fleet. If you want to sit up front and ask questions, they’ll be glad to show you how to drive it (but not let you drive it - you need to get your own).

FWIW, after my uncle showed me how to start his 1936-or-so truck, he gave me a ride around town. Got lots of waves. :)

Re: Each Decade That Passes, Fewer People Report Knowing How to Drive Stick Shifts

#54

Post by Simulacra »

This will probably get some hate but stick shift is an anachronism to an era when it was needed due to lack of computerization. Some purists will say it's better for high performance vehicles, but when do you really need that manual shift that the automatic won't do? It's like saying more people are growing up not knowing how to use a rotary telephone - of course, it's no longer necessary, like manual shifting.

Re: Each Decade That Passes, Fewer People Report Knowing How to Drive Stick Shifts

#55

Post by tompark »

In the US that's fine but it's helpful to be able to drive a stick when you're traveling.

The times I rented/hired a campervan in New Zealand and in Iceland, they were manual transmission. I heard recently the ones in New Zealand are automatic nowadays. (That's good because I wasn't used to shifting with my left hand and was kinda freaked out for the first half hour or so of driving.)

A guy I knew had volunteered on Lesbos during the refugee crisis and can't drive a stick so he couldn't drive there. The availability of rental cars on islands can be pretty limited. A couple years ago I was on Madeira and apparently the only affordable rentals there are manual transmission subcompacts.

Re: Each Decade That Passes, Fewer People Report Knowing How to Drive Stick Shifts

#56

Post by Mandatum »

tompark wrote: post #55

In the US that's fine but it's helpful to be able to drive a stick when you're traveling. The times I rented/hired a campervan in New Zealand and in Iceland, they were manual transmission. I heard recently the ones in New Zealand are automatic nowadays. (That's good because I wasn't used to shifting with my left hand and was kinda freaked out for the first half hour or so of driving.) A guy I knew had volunteered on…

We always bought manual/"stick shift" because they were cheaper in AU/NZ. Not the case nowadays.

Re: Each Decade That Passes, Fewer People Report Knowing How to Drive Stick Shifts

#57

Post by bozzcl »

OldHand2018 wrote: post #30
hindsightbias wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Reviews of many CVT equipped vehicles are pretty consistent in complaints about the transmissions. Have been looking at 5 different brands and while they offer better mileage, there are many complaints about gearing and reliability.

Car makers program CVTs to act like automatics, almost completely eliminating the benefit of a CVT. I’ve got a Subaru with a CVT and I’ve become used to it; I’ll never love it. Mine is the H6 engine paired to the heavy duty CVT. It’s a good thing it will last a long time, as it’s going to be my last Subaru (I’ve driven both the NA and turbo 4 with the CVT and would never buy one).

Subaru CVTs are especially bad from what I've heard. I tried a WRX with one back in 2015, but unfortunately I wasn't too experienced with them to really tell how bad it was. Went with a manual a few years later, though.

Re: Each Decade That Passes, Fewer People Report Knowing How to Drive Stick Shifts

#59

Post by bcrl »

Simulacra wrote: post #54

This will probably get some hate but stick shift is an anachronism to an era when it was needed due to lack of computerization. Some purists will say it's better for high performance vehicles, but when do you really need that manual shift that the automatic won't do? It's like saying more people are growing up not knowing how to use a rotary telephone - of course, it's no longer necessary, like manual shifting.

I find that driving a manual transmission makes me pay more attention to what I'm doing while driving, which is a good thing. Studies in the airline industry have shown that too much automation is a bad thing. Humans aren't good at transitioning from being outside of the control loop to being completely in control in an emergency situation. Higher levels of engagement are a good thing in some ways.
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