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Smart spaces will fine petrol car owners illegally parking in electric bays

thetimes.co.uk

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Re: Smart spaces will fine petrol car owners illegally parking in electric bays

#51

Post by AnthonyMouse »

jtsiskin wrote: post #45
orangeshark wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

See red light cameras. You recieve a ticket through the mail and you get pictures and a video of the violation. There is a lot of people against it and some governments have legistation against the use of it.

I thought that was mainly because red light cameras often lead to an increase in collisions because a driver is more likely to stop unsafely if they are worried about the light changing

Which is, in turn, caused by the unsafe shortening of the yellow light commonly used in combination with red light cameras in order to maximize ticket revenue. Because with an adequately timed yellow light, few people actually run the red light and the cameras become an expensive money pit that can't pay for themselves.

Re: Smart spaces will fine petrol car owners illegally parking in electric bays

#53

Post by AnthonyMouse »

sandworm101 wrote: post #48
hannob wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's surprising because car drivers are used to the fact that rules are not or rarely enforced. Just think about it: Technically it would be no big problem to enforce speed limits widely. The technology for speeding cameras isn't exceptionally complex, you could mass-produce them and deploy them basically in every street. I'm not aware of any country doing that.

>> The technology for speeding cameras Speed cameras are not the go-to tech. Nearly every car on the road has a GPS, either organic to the vehicle or inside the driver's phone. If we wanted to actually enforce speed limits it would be a trivial matter to have google forward the relevant information. This was done by a few rental car companies many moons ago (circa 2001). Speeding laws don't know how to account for su…

> If we wanted to actually enforce speed limits it would be a trivial matter to have google forward the relevant information.

So then you get a speeding fine for being a passenger?

Wouldn't people just turn off their phones?

> Of course, if we really care, it would be trivial to limit all cars to a particular mas speed while on public roads.

This is useless because most "speeding" would be within the limit for the country, e.g. there are places in the US with a speed limit of 85 MPH, whereas most of the problem is really people driving 70 in a 45.

And trying to enforce the actual speed limit on the specific road would be fragile and dangerous because if your vehicle detects the limit wrong it could force you to drive 30+MPH below the flow of traffic and cause an accident.

Re: Smart spaces will fine petrol car owners illegally parking in electric bays

#54

Post by TheBill »

sandworm101 wrote: post #44
olivermarks wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

'all over the place' - what do you mean by 'place'? If we fast forward to a world where the majority of vehicles are electric, this would mean vast parking areas with a smart grid underneath that meters charges to users. (Once ICE has been vanquished vast tax revenue will be gone, someone has to pay for the power, it will be you). In an urban environment presumably every lighting pole will have a charging point since…

>> presumably every lighting pole will have a charging point since they are on the last century grid. The new light poles in my area all have solar panels. The solar+battery kit is cheaper than the cost to run the underground wires. The real jokes is that with the days so short, and the nights so cold, some poles are running out of power just before dawn. There have been experiments with running intersections (traffi…

Roundabouts. If it's that rural, why put in traffic lights?

Re: Smart spaces will fine petrol car owners illegally parking in electric bays

#55

Post by dwighttk »

sandworm101 wrote: post #48
hannob wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's surprising because car drivers are used to the fact that rules are not or rarely enforced. Just think about it: Technically it would be no big problem to enforce speed limits widely. The technology for speeding cameras isn't exceptionally complex, you could mass-produce them and deploy them basically in every street. I'm not aware of any country doing that.

>> The technology for speeding cameras Speed cameras are not the go-to tech. Nearly every car on the road has a GPS, either organic to the vehicle or inside the driver's phone. If we wanted to actually enforce speed limits it would be a trivial matter to have google forward the relevant information. This was done by a few rental car companies many moons ago (circa 2001). Speeding laws don't know how to account for su…

>it would be a trivial matter to have google forward the relevant information.

oof... Glad Google doesn't have that info about me.

Re: Smart spaces will fine petrol car owners illegally parking in electric bays

#56

Post by hannob »

choeger wrote: post #34
hannob wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's surprising because car drivers are used to the fact that rules are not or rarely enforced. Just think about it: Technically it would be no big problem to enforce speed limits widely. The technology for speeding cameras isn't exceptionally complex, you could mass-produce them and deploy them basically in every street. I'm not aware of any country doing that.

The same holds for a lot of other rules, from public transportation tickets over legal fireworks and drinking age to softer drugs and taxes. Society as a whole seems to be generally fine with smaller infractions and I consider this a good thing, tbh. I would be perfectly fine with a similar scheme for traffic laws. The thing with speeding cameras is that they could easily be adjusted to allow for 20% (say at most 20k…

I live in a city where 48 people were killed by cars last year. I am not fine with that.

Re: Smart spaces will fine petrol car owners illegally parking in electric bays

#57

Post by spiritplumber »

notauser wrote: post #47
olivermarks wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most petrol/gasoline stations make the majority of their money selling other products, particularly in non urban locations. Milk, newspapers, magazines etc. This business model makes refuelling stations a viable business since the margins on fuel costs are so slim. One of the challenges with the crude political attempts to force EV usage (carrot/subsidies, Stick/fines) is the lack of coherent planning behind it. What…

The cycle lane on Kensington High Street (a major London East-to-West route) actually sped up car journeys. https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2021/jan/01/removed-lond... When it was removed the study "calculated that average trip times eastbound increased from 5min 39sec to 8min 14sec, with those westbound rising from 5min 48sec to 6min 27sec."

... so why the heck did they not un-remove it after that

Re: Smart spaces will fine petrol car owners illegally parking in electric bays

#58

Post by 0xCMP »

jtsiskin wrote: post #45
orangeshark wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

See red light cameras. You recieve a ticket through the mail and you get pictures and a video of the violation. There is a lot of people against it and some governments have legistation against the use of it.

I thought that was mainly because red light cameras often lead to an increase in collisions because a driver is more likely to stop unsafely if they are worried about the light changing

IIRC there was also the argument that since an officer hadn't seen the crime committed it did not hold or something.

I recall hearing about legal cases which made the city I was in disable and then remove them because they became useless after the rulings.

Re: Smart spaces will fine petrol car owners illegally parking in electric bays

#59

Post by macintux »

robertlagrant wrote: post #30
ehvatum wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quiet, the UK will start fining for this too if they think of it.

And we should. This is obvious bad behaviour.

Depends on the context. Why waste the fuel to start and move a vehicle if there’s not enough traffic to demand a free pump?

Re: Smart spaces will fine petrol car owners illegally parking in electric bays

#60

Post by dawnerd »

So if a car stops charging for whatever reason (fault, someone unplugs, finished charging) they get fined too since they're not actively charging? Seems like a system with more potential problems than it solves.

In general I'm against any system that automatically fines people.

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