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Cloudflare Pages: the best way to build JAMstack websites

blog.cloudflare.com

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Re: Cloudflare Pages: the best way to build JAMstack websites

#51

Post by elithrar »

nrmitchi wrote: post #33
no_wizard wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is some marketing here to be sure, but in some sense, they are at least partially right in that: - they aren’t just reselling AWS services (if I recall correctly Netlify and to at least some extent Vercel do, for instance) - They will be providing their own database platform (coming soon according to the blog post, as of 12/17/2020) which means they can provide the ability to have a single end to end provider f…

Yes, Cloudflare's offering here has promises of adding more functionality in the future, but I don't think that changes my point. At the moment, it is fundamentally the same as existing tools. "Worker" functionality is already available on both Netlify and Vercel. Cloudflare's version will obviously have a tighter integration into the rest of Cloudflare. I've written up a summary of tools/options in this space in the…

> "Worker" functionality is already available on both Netlify and Vercel.

Workers at those providers do not run _at the edge_ for each request. They lean on AWS Lambda to pre-generate or render assets, but you can't reliably run a function there on every user-facing request without a noticeable latency penalty.

Re: Cloudflare Pages: the best way to build JAMstack websites

#52

Post by Viruptc »

jgrahamc wrote: post #5
StratusBen wrote: post #3

Cloudflare is increasingly becoming one of the more interesting companies out there. I feel like they're shifting more and more from being a straight up CDN and trying to dip their toes into things that are closer to but not quite exactly IaaS. Kind of like a better developer experience on top of certain AWS services.

TBH we've never been a "straight up CDN".

I find it absolutely fascinating that the CEO, CTO, PMs, the techs etc. all are actively replying on HN no matter if it is regarding a 2 page personal blog or a full blown e-commerce enterprise customer.

This builds a lot of trust in Cloudfare imho. Thank you!

Re: Cloudflare Pages: the best way to build JAMstack websites

#53

Post by harrisreynolds »

I built an integration with Netlify that allows users of WeBase to build websites/applications with our tool and deploy to Netlify [1].

I'd love to be able to build a similar integration with Cloudflare pages.

How cool is it to build with a UI tool and deploy in seconds to global infrastructure?

[1] https://www.webase.com/blog/build-with-webase-deploy-to-netl...

Re: Cloudflare Pages: the best way to build JAMstack websites

#54

Post by JoachimSchipper »

wolco2 wrote: post #48
no_wizard wrote: post #20

I was wondering when this was going to happen! This is a legitimate contender here against Gatsby, Netlify, AWS Amplify and the like One thing I like about this over all the others is they aren’t (to my knowledge) just reselling AWS features with added convenience (not that this is an issue or bad, but this a lot of what Netlify does with their lamdas for instance, if I recall correctly) and their CDN is top notch IM…

Don't let a lack of a job posting stop you, I would find someone on twitter and reach out.

There is (now?) an explicit "P.S. We're hiring" on the page ;-)

Re: Cloudflare Pages: the best way to build JAMstack websites

#55

Post by Animats »

Check their terms.[1]

First of all, you're giving them a license to your content for their purposes. "By submitting, posting, or publishing your content, suggestions, enhancement requests, recommendations, feedback, information, data, or comments (“Content”) to any Website or Online Service, you are granting Cloudflare a perpetual, irrevocable, worldwide, non-exclusive, royalty-free right and license (with the right to sublicense) to use, incorporate, exploit, display, perform, reproduce, distribute, and prepare derivative works of your Content. You will retain ownership of your Content, however, any use of your Content by Cloudflare may be without any compensation paid to you." For example, Cloudflare could make a copy of your site and monetize it.

Second, you can be cancelled at any time. "We may at our sole discretion suspend or terminate your access to the Websites and/or Online Services at any time, with or without notice for any reason or no reason at all. We also reserve the right to modify or discontinue the Websites and/or Online Services at any time (including, without limitation, by limiting or discontinuing certain features of the Websites and/or Online Services) without notice to you. We will have no liability whatsoever on account of any change to the Websites and/or Online Services or any suspension or termination of your access to or use of the Websites and/or Online Services." For example, if you were promoting a product that competes with Cloudflare, your site could be taken down with no notice.

Those are the big ones. Also, there's no uptime guarantee, an overreaching indemnification clause, and the usual "I am altering the deal. Pray I do not alter it further" clause.

It's about as bad as the Apple App Store.

[1] https://www.cloudflare.com/website-terms/

Re: Cloudflare Pages: the best way to build JAMstack websites

#56

Post by JoachimSchipper »

string wrote: post #46

Always pleased to see more alternatives to Netlify/Vercel. I love how easy Netlify makes it to deploy things, but I don't really understand their pricing. I recently built a pretty basic static webapp that would have racked up around £100 in bandwidth charges (~0.5TB) in the first 24 hours on Netlify. I stuck it on BunnyCDN instead after I realised this and it ended up costing around £3. The five or so minutes I save…

Anyone reselling AWS services wants to price bandwidth above AWS' price, and AWS' bandwidth pricing is high. (E.g. AWS EC2 in us-east-1 to the internet costs up to ~0.09/GB, so your ~0.5 TB would end up at around £33 - although Netlify will obviously have some volume discounts.)

Re: Cloudflare Pages: the best way to build JAMstack websites

#57

Post by btheory »

markelliot wrote: post #11

I’d love to see a version of this (or Netlify, Vercel, etc) that didn’t bundle CI with the preview and deploy steps so that I can pick my own CI and then effectively use the “CDN” as the highly qualified host of my static assets.

https://www.moovweb.com/

https://developer.moovweb.com/

We built this as a 'control plane' for everything above your backend APIs. You can bring your own CI/CD and get the same 'infinite staging' and other features that help bring Jamstack principles to large, dynamic websites.

Re: Cloudflare Pages: the best way to build JAMstack websites

#58

Post by ryan29 »

rita3ko wrote: post #47
ryan29 wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it would be extremely useful to have some type of simple authentication system for the preview URLs. I think the One-Time Pin Login [1] available with Cloudflare Access would be a really great fit if I could drive it from a list of email addresses in the GitHub repo. As a use case, consider a small project where someone is looking for very preliminary feedback and wants to ask friends, family, trusted colleag…

You're just one step ahead of us :) We'll be working on building in one-click configuration to have Cloudflare Access in front of your preview deployments specifically for this purpose. More good news: we support private repos today :)

That's awesome! The thing that would make it valuable to me would be to send links to friends or family that have never heard of Cloudflare. If it got tied into Cloudflare Teams or something that added even the tiniest bit of friction it would significantly devalue it IMO. For example, I'd consider OAuth "log in with X platform" to be too much friction. Signing up for an account somewhere would never happen, at least for my use case.

The ideal scenario for me would be if I'm on the phone or video conferencing with someone and can send a link to their email that would grant them instant access with a single click, plus repeat access by doing the one-time-pin flow.

Do you know of any Cloudflare products that would let me build something like that one-time-pin auth flow into a user facing app driven by Workers? Most of the info I can find seems to assume it's going to be used to protect internal resources for companies and the pricing would never work for a user facing app. I might just be missing it though. It took me a while to figure out MS has Azure B2B vs Azure AD which is a similar scenario.

Just rouging it out in my head, I think (I'm probably getting some of it wrong) I could build something like that that's really inexpensive to run using Workers. I'm thinking something like 1 invocation for "unauthorized", a second for the auth request + JWT generation + email link, and a +1 per request cost for a worker to check the JWT / resource request.

IIRC Workers are $0.50/million runs with KV to match, so I could do _a lot_ of authenticating for $5. Compare that to something like Cognito where it's $275 USD for your second 50k users and the one-time-pin style auth running on Workers starts to feel like a good option for low value accounts that don't require a sophisticated auth system with 2FA, etc..

I say that in the context of thinking about a product where people would log in so infrequently they'd probably be doing a password reset anyway. Or they could just be like my parents where every login is a password reset. Lol.

Re: Cloudflare Pages: the best way to build JAMstack websites

#59

Post by steveklabnik »

Animats wrote: post #55

Check their terms.[1] First of all, you're giving them a license to your content for their purposes. "By submitting, posting, or publishing your content, suggestions, enhancement requests, recommendations, feedback, information, data, or comments (“Content”) to any Website or Online Service, you are granting Cloudflare a perpetual, irrevocable, worldwide, non-exclusive, royalty-free right and license (with the right…

(no longer at cloudflare)

This is the TOS for cloudflare.com, not the TOS for cloudflare's services, I believe.

See https://www.cloudflare.com/terms/ for the self-serve plan TOS, for example.

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