Former Google CEO Calls Social Networks ‘Amplifiers for Idiots’ • Hacker News Board

Re: Former Google CEO Calls Social Networks ‘Amplifiers for Idiots’

#51

Post by jokethrowaway » Thu, Oct 22, 2020, 11:37 PM UTC

thu2111 wrote: post #22

grawprog wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Address the issue of trust, and you can fix the real issues here. How can the issue of trust be fixed when most of these institution's goals are not really aligned with the general public? A company with the goal of profitting as much as possible from consumers and a government with the goal of helping those companies line their pockets as much as possible isn't really inline with what the average person wants. Beca…

Most people don't have a naive trust companies, and that's good. Consumer's trust in companies is far more nuanced and complex: we may for example trust that if we buy an Apple device it will be well built, but we don't trust that we're getting good value for money because we know Apple has a reputation for being expensive. This is an excellent feature of capitalism. Incentives are front and centre, people don't (usu…

I don't see why I wouldn't trust a charity to do what they claim, filtered by their brand reputation and public opinion (exactly like I would for a corporation).

I can't trust the government (and education) to do anything but try to hoard more money at the expense of citizens.

The only problem is the governmental parasites polarising and dividing the people, while increasing spending every year.

Re: Former Google CEO Calls Social Networks ‘Amplifiers for Idiots’

#52

Post by handol » Thu, Oct 22, 2020, 11:48 PM UTC

gowld wrote: post #49

thu2111 wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most people don't have a naive trust companies, and that's good. Consumer's trust in companies is far more nuanced and complex: we may for example trust that if we buy an Apple device it will be well built, but we don't trust that we're getting good value for money because we know Apple has a reputation for being expensive. This is an excellent feature of capitalism. Incentives are front and centre, people don't (usu…

Why would someone choose to buy an Apple if they didn't find it good value for money?

Because there is something about the Apple product they want, that they can't get somewhere else.

Re: Former Google CEO Calls Social Networks ‘Amplifiers for Idiots’

#53

Post by anm89 » Thu, Oct 22, 2020, 11:56 PM UTC

TheAdamAndChe wrote: post #7

I disagree with Schmidt. Misinformation is spreading because trust in institutions is eroding. This eroding trust is because of transparency and improved information dissemination. Most people don't trust the news anymore because it can easily be seen how biased they are. They don't trust institutions because they see how partisan most are. You can't just ban or regulate social media and expect the toothpaste to just…

I think it's worth noting that the news being biased is a fairly new phenomenon. They didnt just expose some long standing problem with prtisan media. The partisan media barely existed 20 years ago.

Re: Former Google CEO Calls Social Networks ‘Amplifiers for Idiots’

#54

Post by sjg007 » Fri, Oct 23, 2020, 12:12 AM UTC

TheAdamAndChe wrote: post #7

I disagree with Schmidt. Misinformation is spreading because trust in institutions is eroding. This eroding trust is because of transparency and improved information dissemination. Most people don't trust the news anymore because it can easily be seen how biased they are. They don't trust institutions because they see how partisan most are. You can't just ban or regulate social media and expect the toothpaste to just…

Got any specific examples? Our institutions are being actively degraded on purpose by the Executive and a complicit Senate.

Re: Former Google CEO Calls Social Networks ‘Amplifiers for Idiots’

#55

Post by sjg007 » Fri, Oct 23, 2020, 12:19 AM UTC

tt433 wrote: post #26

thu2111 wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is that some random YouTube channel, Facebook page or a lone idiot screaming on social media is not going to be less biased and partisan. Are you sure? Joe Rogan seems to get a pretty good mix of people from across the political spectrum and explore their views in far more intellectual and nuanced ways than any TV channels I know.

He also sells snake oil

The default state should be to treat everything as suspect until proven otherwise. The problem is that goes against the central tenant of Americanism.

Re: Former Google CEO Calls Social Networks ‘Amplifiers for Idiots’

#56

Post by wh1t3n01s3 » Fri, Oct 23, 2020, 12:28 AM UTC

Misinformation is spreading because social networks (and Google search) AIs are tuned to improve users engagement. This causes exponential confirmation bias. So misinformation is created to feed the ‘idiots’ engagement.

Re: Former Google CEO Calls Social Networks ‘Amplifiers for Idiots’

#57

Post by pixl97 » Fri, Oct 23, 2020, 2:49 AM UTC

anm89 wrote: post #53

TheAdamAndChe wrote: post #7

I disagree with Schmidt. Misinformation is spreading because trust in institutions is eroding. This eroding trust is because of transparency and improved information dissemination. Most people don't trust the news anymore because it can easily be seen how biased they are. They don't trust institutions because they see how partisan most are. You can't just ban or regulate social media and expect the toothpaste to just…

I think it's worth noting that the news being biased is a fairly new phenomenon. They didnt just expose some long standing problem with prtisan media. The partisan media barely existed 20 years ago.

Eh, that depends. There was plenty of biased news in 2000. Media consolidation has started long before that.

Re: Former Google CEO Calls Social Networks ‘Amplifiers for Idiots’

#58

Post by pixl97 » Fri, Oct 23, 2020, 2:56 AM UTC

ludocode wrote: post #9

Arnt wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Obviously the search term you type is what you want to see, so in a sense you're right. But that wasn't what you meant, right? Google selects a large set of search results based on what it thinks your query means, then weighs each result according to many, many criteria, I've heard there are about 140 but that's a long time ago, and finally orders them by aggregate weight. You may assume that all of those criteria ar…

Google doesn't just use the search term. It also uses your search and browsing history. This is why if you're a programmer, you're more likely to get results from StackOverflow because your search is more likely to be about programming. It's one reason why people can get better search results from Google than, say, DuckDuckGo. If you've been watching lots of conspiracy YouTube videos and reading lots of conspiracy bl…

Google: "hi, I see you watched a WWII video. Would you like to like to join the National Socialist party?"

Re: Former Google CEO Calls Social Networks ‘Amplifiers for Idiots’

#59

Post by ksec » Fri, Oct 23, 2020, 6:13 AM UTC

TheAdamAndChe wrote: post #7

I disagree with Schmidt. Misinformation is spreading because trust in institutions is eroding. This eroding trust is because of transparency and improved information dissemination. Most people don't trust the news anymore because it can easily be seen how biased they are. They don't trust institutions because they see how partisan most are. You can't just ban or regulate social media and expect the toothpaste to just…

I think while what you said is true, trust is only half of the story.

People choosing to believe whatever that fits their worldview. And they have their own bias in choosing to view those information. Their bias were formed from years if not decades of their experience and observation with real world.

Even if we have a magic wand to restore everything to the old days. These people's world view wouldn't have changed.

Modern Day Media amplifies and solidify those world view. Creating an even more polarising society than ever before.

Re: Former Google CEO Calls Social Networks ‘Amplifiers for Idiots’

#60

Post by ksec » Fri, Oct 23, 2020, 6:22 AM UTC

thu2111 wrote: post #22

grawprog wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Address the issue of trust, and you can fix the real issues here. How can the issue of trust be fixed when most of these institution's goals are not really aligned with the general public? A company with the goal of profitting as much as possible from consumers and a government with the goal of helping those companies line their pockets as much as possible isn't really inline with what the average person wants. Beca…

Most people don't have a naive trust companies, and that's good. Consumer's trust in companies is far more nuanced and complex: we may for example trust that if we buy an Apple device it will be well built, but we don't trust that we're getting good value for money because we know Apple has a reputation for being expensive. This is an excellent feature of capitalism. Incentives are front and centre, people don't (usu…

>Most people don't have a naive trust companies

I trusted Steve Jobs' Apple far more not because of some RDF or whatever Media spin. I trust it because it fits my world view and most of their action could well be explained. Trust is hard to build up, and normally after many incidents happened.

I lost that trust once you repeatedly find they were lying. Tim Cook's Apple lied during the Qualcomm case, and in the IMG case. Obviously Tim Cook was acting in Apple's best interest. But it was no longer Steve Jobs Apple.

It just shows Money and incentives are often ( for most people ) their motives.