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What is expected of a engineering manager?

blog.rlmflores.me

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Re: What is expected of a engineering manager?

#51

Post by ChrisMarshallNY »

Timberwolf wrote: post #14

I think the article misses what I think is a vitally important part of the job: being a crap shield. A lot of the work of an EM is wading into the slurry pit with a shovel so your team are free to get the job done: bashing your head against InfoSec teams stuck in the '80s so the CI/CD toolchain can deploy to production, negotiating freedom with a CTO who wants to specify everything to the level of individual data str…

Absolutely. This is especially relevant, these days, when HR departments are basically taking an actively adversarial role towards employees.

I used to get crap from HR, if I chose to resolve personnel issues without involving them.

The problem was, they had only two speeds: Do Nothing, or KILL ALL THE BABIES. Nothing in between; despite their constant harping about how they were "on our side." Their job was to keep the C-suite happy. It was absolutely amazing how many rules that were "hard and fast," and "applies to everyone here," would suddenly fail to be implemented, when it was a C-suite doing the rulebreaking.

There were also companywide policies, meant to appease union employees, that would also apply to the other 90% of the company that wasn't union (and thus, did not have the mitigating benefits), or that were in place to manage hourly employees, but also applied to exempt (from a life) employees.

It was my job to try to mask that kind of crap from my employees, and I got called on the carpet a few times, because of it. I would do it all over again, if I had to.

Re: What is expected of a engineering manager?

#52

Post by the_arun »

Few things I learnt so far:

1. Managers need to be human & kind.

2. Shielding their team from crap (as someone mentioned already)

3. Don't pitch one team member vs another - this is toxic. Instead nurture their strength. Our competitors are outside the team, not inside

4. Cheer lead/Sponsor for the team outside. Genuinely back your team.

5. Always expect your team members are smarter than you - give them that trust. Thank them for things they teach you.

6. Managing is more like parenting college kids (not toddlers/middle schoolers). You want them to survive worst and replace you if needed. So you too can grow. But avoid micro managing.

7. Learn to have tough conversations - This could be for their/team's improvement.

Re: What is expected of a engineering manager?

#53

Post by strig »

Timberwolf wrote: post #14

I think the article misses what I think is a vitally important part of the job: being a crap shield. A lot of the work of an EM is wading into the slurry pit with a shovel so your team are free to get the job done: bashing your head against InfoSec teams stuck in the '80s so the CI/CD toolchain can deploy to production, negotiating freedom with a CTO who wants to specify everything to the level of individual data str…

> configuration galley

What does this mean?

Re: What is expected of a engineering manager?

#54

Post by pojzon »

peterwoerner wrote: post #43
Timberwolf wrote: post #14

I think the article misses what I think is a vitally important part of the job: being a crap shield. A lot of the work of an EM is wading into the slurry pit with a shovel so your team are free to get the job done: bashing your head against InfoSec teams stuck in the '80s so the CI/CD toolchain can deploy to production, negotiating freedom with a CTO who wants to specify everything to the level of individual data str…

The #1 job of a manager (in all fields) is to keep his people working. It doesn't matter if it is engineering, manufacturing or the local burger joint. A managers #1 job is to keep his people working.

What to do when people dont deliver ? In my current company mgrs say “we did our best”, when in fact I see ppl slacking as hell (days of doing nothing).

Re: What is expected of a engineering manager?

#55

Post by pc86 »

vonmoltke wrote: post #50
pc86 wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"The proper way" is not an objective thing and to present it as such is disingenuous. The best managers I've ever worked for have all, without fail, worked daily to keep as much nonsense away from the team as possible. The worst have either only been concerned with their personal advancement, or would just make the team basically fend for itself.

> "The proper way" is not an objective thing and to present it as such is disingenuous. I agree that it isn't objective, but how is believing it is disingenuous?

Management isn't math. It's not a science, and there are successful managers who push as much crap onto their directs as they can, and there are successful managers who take as much of that crap as they can to prevent it from reaching their teams.

Re: What is expected of a engineering manager?

#56

Post by systemvoltage »

ed312 wrote: post #45
systemvoltage wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think that would be covered under the idea "Lead by example". When the manager is competent to understand, console and provide guidance to the team when they're struggling - even slight slivers of technical skills and knowhow, the rapport they build is unbreakable. The idea is to genuinely belong to a team, not just on an org chart. When troops are in the battle field, they form unbreakable bonds because they have…

This is a really tricky thing to nail down as an EM. My first eng leadership role I was promoted out of the team. Everyone already knew I had what it took (I was one of the core group pushing hard to get the product out the door) so "engineering respect" came naturally. Fast forward to being hired as an EM - I realized I had to earn this all over again AND I couldn't do it just be being another peer in the trenches.…

Curious how you define a team’s success?

Re: What is expected of a engineering manager?

#57

Post by pc86 »

x87678r wrote: post #40
pc86 wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"The proper way" is not an objective thing and to present it as such is disingenuous. The best managers I've ever worked for have all, without fail, worked daily to keep as much nonsense away from the team as possible. The worst have either only been concerned with their personal advancement, or would just make the team basically fend for itself.

Curiously in your opinion who ended up being more successful?

I think in general most companies, especially large ones, reward managers who push crap onto their directs. Anecdotally, the best manager I've ever had viciously protected us from executive nonsense, and he's also the most successful by far (and he was before I started). I don't think that's the norm, though.

Re: What is expected of a engineering manager?

#58

Post by ryandrake »

ChrisMarshallNY wrote: post #51
Timberwolf wrote: post #14

I think the article misses what I think is a vitally important part of the job: being a crap shield. A lot of the work of an EM is wading into the slurry pit with a shovel so your team are free to get the job done: bashing your head against InfoSec teams stuck in the '80s so the CI/CD toolchain can deploy to production, negotiating freedom with a CTO who wants to specify everything to the level of individual data str…

Absolutely. This is especially relevant, these days, when HR departments are basically taking an actively adversarial role towards employees. I used to get crap from HR, if I chose to resolve personnel issues without involving them. The problem was, they had only two speeds: Do Nothing, or KILL ALL THE BABIES. Nothing in between; despite their constant harping about how they were "on our side." Their job was to keep…

Maybe I'm just extremely lucky, but I think in 20 years of working at multiple companies (as an IC), I've never really even had contact with HR besides my first and last days. I don't think I could even name a single HR person I've ever met. They tend to be there to hand me the benefits literature, then at the end I give my badge back to them, and that's it. What on earth is happening in companies where HR is part of the daily life of a standard "3rd engineer from the left" employee?

Re: What is expected of a engineering manager?

#59

Post by rurp »

kemiller2002 wrote: post #6
meagher wrote: post #2

One thing missing from my recent engineering managers is lack of relevant coding experience. You don't need to be an great engineer to be a good manager, but it definitely helps when your manager knows enough about the battles fought in the trenches and can offer actual feedback/support instead of nodding for 30m, then going to another 1:1.

At my last job I had an interesting (nice) experience. My boss wasn't an engineer, he was a project manager, but that didn't hinder him. I think what made him successful was that he cared. He'd say over and over, "I'm not a developer, I need help understanding." We would sit in a meeting and walk through problems. He was very calm and patient and acted genuinely interested in what the problem was. He would ask questi…

My current manager is a lot like this. He has never written a line of code but is surprisingly good at scoping work and understanding how important various tasks are. I think that any manager who is smart, cares about the work, and has good discussions with their engineers can develop a solid understanding of software projects.

There's no magic to it but, sadly, that combination of qualities is a lot less common than I would like.

Re: What is expected of a engineering manager?

#60

Post by ChrisMarshallNY »

ryandrake wrote: post #58
ChrisMarshallNY wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Absolutely. This is especially relevant, these days, when HR departments are basically taking an actively adversarial role towards employees. I used to get crap from HR, if I chose to resolve personnel issues without involving them. The problem was, they had only two speeds: Do Nothing, or KILL ALL THE BABIES. Nothing in between; despite their constant harping about how they were "on our side." Their job was to keep…

Maybe I'm just extremely lucky, but I think in 20 years of working at multiple companies (as an IC), I've never really even had contact with HR besides my first and last days. I don't think I could even name a single HR person I've ever met. They tend to be there to hand me the benefits literature, then at the end I give my badge back to them, and that's it. What on earth is happening in companies where HR is part of…

I was a manager, so I had plenty of interaction with HR.

For the most part, they weren't actually bad people, but their job was to be fairly two-faced. I think it caused a lot of issues. HR had the highest turnover in the company.

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