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$1 hearing aid could treat millions with hearing loss

sciencemag.org

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Re: $1 hearing aid could treat millions with hearing loss

#51

Post by tyingq »

anamexis wrote: post #13
janekm wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The $1 figure in the headline is clickbait as it’s only the cost of components for the PCB. Add the PCB + mechanical components + battery + plastic enclosure + assembly + testing + factory margin + overhead and it would be a miracle to come under the cost of existing low-cost hearing aids.

That's not true, the $1 figure for all of the parts. Here's the original, search for "Table 1" for the BOM https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal...

The BOM prices are just wrong. You can find the volume pricing for the MAX9814 and MAX98306. Those two alone add up to more than $1.

Re: $1 hearing aid could treat millions with hearing loss

#52

Post by janekm »

anamexis wrote: post #31
jononor wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Good luck sourcing 3d-printed casings at 0.06 USD, or PCB at 0.05 USD a piece, even in 10k or higher scale. And of course in addition to the BOM comes production costs.

The casing is just a rectangular plastic box with some holes in it, I'm sure you could get some made at that price. Even if the PCB costs 5x the quoted price, you're still rounding down to $1. That said, I have no idea what production costs are for something like this.

I can understand how it may seem that way when a plastic takeaway box costs $0.1, why should this cost any more...

The article's cost assumption is just based on the cost of the raw plastic material, which is hilarious (3D printer time doesn't really come free).

But in more realistic mass production you'd make a mold, and the cost of the mold is dependent on how many "shots" you want to get out of it. Making plastic parts at the cost of takeaway boxes requires expensive high-volume molds.

At 10k volume you'd be happy to get the box for $1 including amortised mold cost (though in reality the box could be much smaller, reducing mold & material costs some).

Re: $1 hearing aid could treat millions with hearing loss

#53

Post by dekhn »

kube-system wrote: post #39
tyingq wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just the BOM image so it's easier to read: https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article/figure/image?size=... Also, I'm not sure where he's getting the prices. Prices for the MAX98306 and MAX9814 seem higher, even in high quantities, than what he's showing.

Interesting that they list the cost of raw PLA pellets for the "mass production cost" of the 3d printed case. This is starting to smell like an exercise in making an incorrect BOM to justify the result they were looking for. Nobody will 3d print you a case for $0.06. If what they meant was that they'd 3d print the case themselves, then it should be the filament or resin listed on the BOM. You probably can get a plast…

If you read enough of Nature and Science you will realize that skilled scientists are practiced in the art of misrepresenting many details of their work to get published.

Note that the pricing in there is organized around the idea of a very massive custom purchase by a large company.

Re: $1 hearing aid could treat millions with hearing loss

#54

Post by janekm »

ajnin wrote: post #23

So this is a very simple circuit. Basically a microphone amplifier directly connected to some earphones with a volume knob. No frequency control of any kind. I'm wondering why this sort of device is not already available like loupe type glasses that we can easily find. I'm thinking this has something to do with legislation and maximum allowed earphone sound levels? Or maybe it is too crude to be actually useful?

It is available, even as in-ear style "hearing aid", for <$10 from the usual factories. I gather it's a little problematic selling them in the US due to medical device regulations...

Re: $1 hearing aid could treat millions with hearing loss

#55

Post by xtracto »

patorjk wrote: post #46

As an aside, there's a lot of exciting regenerative work going on related to hearing at the moment. Sometime soon we may no longer need hearing aids. There are some neat drugs either in clinical trials or about to begin clinical trials that will re-grow hair cells and broken synapses in the cochlea (ex: FX-322, OTO-413, OTO-6XX).

I am closely following FX-322, but mostly for tinnitus. I do have hearing loss, but it is that disrupting so far. But the tinnitus is something I could definitely live without.

Re: $1 hearing aid could treat millions with hearing loss

#56

Post by magicalhippo »

tyingq wrote: post #14

At first, it seemed like a laudable effort. I hate it, though, when someone makes a github repo and sticks a single zip file in it: https://github.com/bhamla-lab/LoCHAid-2020-PLOS-ONE So I found the pdf in the zip file where you can see what it is. It's a MAX 98306 amp. The only peripherals are the typical filter capacitors, resistors, volume pot, microphone, etc. So, it's basically this: https://www.adafruit.com/pro…

Actually it uses two IC's and the more interesting one, in relative terms, is the MAX9814[1] microphone amplifier with automatic gain control.

I suspect there are cheaper class-D IC's that could be used than the MAX98306, but for a prototype why not.

It also puts the volume control potentiometer on the amplifier output which seems wasteful for a battery operated device.

[1]: https://www.maximintegrated.com/en/products/analog/audio/MAX...

Re: $1 hearing aid could treat millions with hearing loss

#57

Post by chrisweekly »

ampdepolymerase wrote: post #12
rini17 wrote: post #7

Hearing aids (nor cochlear implants, for that matter) do not "restore hearing", except for light hearing loss. They are only like crutches (not even wheelchair). For example, to follow conversations or phone/skype with multiple people is very exhausting even with fancy device, because in most cases the "bandwidth" to the brain just isn't available. That said, the hearing aids vendor lock-in is really atrocious and ca…

For a few dollars more it is possible to put a FPGA with perhaps a neural accelerator on it. It may tremendously simplify some of the DSP stack. More importantly, there should be a full-proof app or UI to allow the user to tune the hearing aid appropriately (or coupled with a training course for audiologists in the targeted regions to do so).

full-proof -> fool-proof

NOT being pedantic, just trying to be helpful / educational (esp given the large % of non-native English speakers on HN)

Re: $1 hearing aid could treat millions with hearing loss

#58

Post by andai »

tyingq wrote: post #14

At first, it seemed like a laudable effort. I hate it, though, when someone makes a github repo and sticks a single zip file in it: https://github.com/bhamla-lab/LoCHAid-2020-PLOS-ONE So I found the pdf in the zip file where you can see what it is. It's a MAX 98306 amp. The only peripherals are the typical filter capacitors, resistors, volume pot, microphone, etc. So, it's basically this: https://www.adafruit.com/pro…

Looks like that's it in the first photo in the article: he's holding it in his hands and using earbuds. Presumably it would go in a pocket or clip on to your belt.

Re: $1 hearing aid could treat millions with hearing loss

#59

Post by magicalhippo »

anamexis wrote: post #22
jononor wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The HearingAid.sch PDF says MAX9814 on the JP1 connector on the left side. So are they actually using both?

The MAX9814 is the microphone. Here's the BOM which shows the full breakdown coming in under $1. https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal... (Table 1)

> The MAX9814 is the microphone.

It's the microphone amplifier. This unit still needs an external microphone, as well as headset/plugs.

Re: $1 hearing aid could treat millions with hearing loss

#60

Post by kube-system »

dekhn wrote: post #53
kube-system wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting that they list the cost of raw PLA pellets for the "mass production cost" of the 3d printed case. This is starting to smell like an exercise in making an incorrect BOM to justify the result they were looking for. Nobody will 3d print you a case for $0.06. If what they meant was that they'd 3d print the case themselves, then it should be the filament or resin listed on the BOM. You probably can get a plast…

If you read enough of Nature and Science you will realize that skilled scientists are practiced in the art of misrepresenting many details of their work to get published. Note that the pricing in there is organized around the idea of a very massive custom purchase by a large company.

I don't think there's anything wrong with them citing volume pricing per se. You'd expect something like a hearing aid to be mass produced.

It's the incongruency of the materials listed with the actual materials that would be used in a mass production scenario that I find unscrupulous.

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