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More than 1/3 of all access to Google is now over IPv6

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Re: More than 1/3 of all access to Google is now over IPv6

#51

Post by gvjddbnvdrbv »

walton_simons wrote: post #48

My ISP supports IPv6, and while I can understand why a large organisation would want to use it (especially given the increasing cost and scarcity of IPv4 blocks), I'm still yet to be persuaded of its benefits for home users. I admit that I only have a very cursory understanding of how it works, and perhaps I'm just stuck in my ways, but the scale and complexity seems so extreme compared to IPv4, with no compensating…

I'm certainly going to be dropping all incoming IPv6 packets when my ISP foists IPv6 on us.

Re: More than 1/3 of all access to Google is now over IPv6

#52

Post by hansjorg »

BadBadJellyBean wrote: post #29
hansjorg wrote: post #25

China is aiming for 100% in 2025 according to APNIC, so they've got some ways to go from the 0.53% seen by Google. Is the great firewall ipv4 only perhaps?

Google is blocked in China. So I guess not a lot of traffic is coming from Chinese IPs.

Google has a lot of services and landing pages though, is everything completely blocked?

Re: More than 1/3 of all access to Google is now over IPv6

#53

Post by throwaway2048 »

walton_simons wrote: post #48

My ISP supports IPv6, and while I can understand why a large organisation would want to use it (especially given the increasing cost and scarcity of IPv4 blocks), I'm still yet to be persuaded of its benefits for home users. I admit that I only have a very cursory understanding of how it works, and perhaps I'm just stuck in my ways, but the scale and complexity seems so extreme compared to IPv4, with no compensating…

The advantage of ipv6 for consumers is that many ISPs (especially non american ISPs) don't and can't hand out public IPv4 addresses, due to the lack of remaining IPv4 addresses for them to allocate.

The choice isn't between every device being globally routable (which is easily solved by a firewall WITHOUT NAT) and a single routable address, the choice is between zero public routable addresses, and as many as you need.

Re: More than 1/3 of all access to Google is now over IPv6

#54

Post by tialaramex »

buro9 wrote: post #41
theduality wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My ISP in the Netherlands (Ziggo) provides me with native IPv6 if I use their supplied router, but forces me onto IPv4 when I use theirs in bridge mode in conjunction with my own router. Still not sure why they do that.

These ISPs are using DS-Lite, Dual-Stack Lite. https://www.juniper.net/documentation/en_US/junos/topics/top... (this isn't a purely Juniper thing, but they have nice diagrams on their documentation) It's a kind of carrier grade NAT with 4over6 baked in. Depending on the version of this they are relying on your modem to perform encap/decap of 4to6, hence when you switch to modem mode or your own router you fall back t…

> unfortunately for me the DSL speed in my area is pretty bad due to being a few KMs from the exchange.

For VDSL the distance to an exchange shouldn't matter. The copper runs to a green box in the street, then another newer-looking green box nearby (or in some cases attached) with fibre in it takes the VDSL signal - and only old-school voice line conversations go to the exchange.

So definitely if previous ADSL speeds were poor it's time to check again. If you just meant that as shorthand then no worries, but I've run into way too many people who have the idea that all DSL is the same.

Re: More than 1/3 of all access to Google is now over IPv6

#55

Post by billpg »

walton_simons wrote: post #48

My ISP supports IPv6, and while I can understand why a large organisation would want to use it (especially given the increasing cost and scarcity of IPv4 blocks), I'm still yet to be persuaded of its benefits for home users. I admit that I only have a very cursory understanding of how it works, and perhaps I'm just stuck in my ways, but the scale and complexity seems so extreme compared to IPv4, with no compensating…

While NAT works very well for home users, servers still need distinct IPs if they are to be accessible by the public. You can get away with shared IPs with some protocols but sometimes you need a whole IP to yourself.

Re: More than 1/3 of all access to Google is now over IPv6

#56

Post by q3k »

walton_simons wrote: post #48

My ISP supports IPv6, and while I can understand why a large organisation would want to use it (especially given the increasing cost and scarcity of IPv4 blocks), I'm still yet to be persuaded of its benefits for home users. I admit that I only have a very cursory understanding of how it works, and perhaps I'm just stuck in my ways, but the scale and complexity seems so extreme compared to IPv4, with no compensating…

> Very happy to be told why I shouldn't do this though.

Because your IPv4 traffic goes (or will, in the future, as IPv4 depletes further) through a slow, overprovisioned CGNAT - making IPv4 much slower then IPv6.

Re: More than 1/3 of all access to Google is now over IPv6

#57

Post by bzb3 »

q3k wrote: post #56
walton_simons wrote: post #48

My ISP supports IPv6, and while I can understand why a large organisation would want to use it (especially given the increasing cost and scarcity of IPv4 blocks), I'm still yet to be persuaded of its benefits for home users. I admit that I only have a very cursory understanding of how it works, and perhaps I'm just stuck in my ways, but the scale and complexity seems so extreme compared to IPv4, with no compensating…

> Very happy to be told why I shouldn't do this though. Because your IPv4 traffic goes (or will, in the future, as IPv4 depletes further) through a slow, overprovisioned CGNAT - making IPv4 much slower then IPv6.

That's scaremongering and simply false. Cgnat servers are not necessarily congested. I've been to several isps with cgnat and none of them suffered from congestion.

On a more personal note, if ipv6 were so great, their fans wouldn't have to make up things to badmouth ipv4.

Re: More than 1/3 of all access to Google is now over IPv6

#58

Post by blibble »

Arnt wrote: post #21
Faaak wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nearly all modern operating systems use the IPv6 privacy extension, which creates random addresses periodically. Thus the tracking is randomized to the /64 (which is an end customer). This is more or less the same as with IPv4 (without CGNAT)

Is a /64 really an end customer? How common is that? Both of my ISPs hand out new ISPs hand out new /64 prefixes every so often. One does it every half-hour, the other is comparable but I don't remember. I think they do it to encourage business customers to get more expensive connections, but the effect on my connections is that each device's IP address changes every few minutes, within the ISP's /32, and doesn't rep…

my residential isp hands out as many /48s as you want

Re: More than 1/3 of all access to Google is now over IPv6

#59

Post by throwaway2048 »

bzb3 wrote: post #57
q3k wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Very happy to be told why I shouldn't do this though. Because your IPv4 traffic goes (or will, in the future, as IPv4 depletes further) through a slow, overprovisioned CGNAT - making IPv4 much slower then IPv6.

That's scaremongering and simply false. Cgnat servers are not necessarily congested. I've been to several isps with cgnat and none of them suffered from congestion. On a more personal note, if ipv6 were so great, their fans wouldn't have to make up things to badmouth ipv4.

NAT is fundamentally a limited technology that has massive scaling problems that simply do not exist in non-nat networking situations.

The larger the network behind the NAT, the more problems you get. This is also before considerations like the fact NAT breaks 2 way connectivity that is the cornerstone of the design of the internet.

>if ipv6 were so great, their fans wouldn't have to make up things to badmouth ipv4.

The explicit goal and reason IPv6 was created was to make up for the short-comings of IPv4.

Re: More than 1/3 of all access to Google is now over IPv6

#60

Post by _-___________-_ »

skissane wrote: post #39
BadBadJellyBean wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google is blocked in China. So I guess not a lot of traffic is coming from Chinese IPs.

Where is the Chinese traffic Google is seeing coming from then? I wonder if anyone is exempt from the Great Firewall? What about senior officials including Xi himself? I’m sure if he asked for unfiltered Internet he’d get it.

Some Google properties work in China, and some blocked properties do work very occasionally.
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