Live data from Hacker News

New restrictions in Hong Kong show that a single lockdown won’t be enough

theatlantic.com

51–60 of 107 posts

Re: New restrictions in Hong Kong show that a single lockdown won’t be enough

#51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right, if there's a resurgence I'm not participating. The cure would be worse than the disease. I encourage susceptible populations to quarantine themselves, rather than everybody quarantining. We must work, date, and life must go on.

The cure would likely be worse than the disease for you . Are millions of people dying an acceptable trade-off for us to be able to date?

Is it an acceptable trade off for you?

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-52002734

Re: New restrictions in Hong Kong show that a single lockdown won’t be enough

#52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right, if there's a resurgence I'm not participating. The cure would be worse than the disease. I encourage susceptible populations to quarantine themselves, rather than everybody quarantining. We must work, date, and life must go on.

The cure would likely be worse than the disease for you . Are millions of people dying an acceptable trade-off for us to be able to date?

There is a legitimate debate of: Cause an Economic Depression vs X times the number of yearly deaths.

Note, the Economic Depression would indirectly cause deaths.

For example everyone agreed that not shutting down the global economic was the correct decision in regards to the Swine Flu pandemic which did cause 100,000 or more deaths.

What if it was 1 million projected deaths, 10 million or 50 million?

I honestly do not know the answer but there are individuals who specializes in these decisions.

Re: New restrictions in Hong Kong show that a single lockdown won’t be enough

#53
post #2

Successive lockdowns and easings are probably going to continue for up to two years. Anybody arguing that the stock market or the economy is going to bounce back quickly in the next two months are either bullshitting you or deluding themselves. No “stimulus” package is going to be effective, because you can’t use spending to stimulate an economy which has been forced to stop producing goods and services. All you will…

/r/Wallstreetbets just had someone put $775k, the person’s entire net worth, into options on the idea that the market will crash by 6/19. I am sure comments like yours give them hope that they are right. Personally, I think that the economy will change significantly, but crash vs recover for markets is different. If suddenly workers got a fair wage and everyone got universal healthcare we could easily see the country…

That's a dumb bet. If the system crashes odds are pretty high they aren't getting paid.

Re: New restrictions in Hong Kong show that a single lockdown won’t be enough

#54

But of course. If you intentionally prevent ppl from being infected then they remain susceptible. Short of a vaccine, you can't put it off forever. Those ppl can't hide forever. This is an expected - or should be - result of "flatten the curve." FTC is not about the virus per se, it's about the healthcare system. That is, to not exceed the volume the healthcare system can handle. Put another way, an increase in the n…

It's amazing how many people copy-paste knowledge without doing the most basic logical checks on it. For example, nobody yet explained to me how flattening the curve is gonna make much difference when say NYC has 3,000 ventilators, and the average time on a ventilator is 20 days. If 1/100 of NYC's 8 million population need a ventilator that'd still be 80,000 ventilators needed. So flattening would reduce the deaths t…

8.000.000 by 100 is 80.000.

And if the governor is able to somehow organize another 30000 ventilators in 3 weeks, your death count goes down from 77k to 44k. Or 11 times 9/11.

Re: New restrictions in Hong Kong show that a single lockdown won’t be enough

#55

“ Hong Kong and Singapore were early examples of places that were able to contain the spread of the virus” cough TAIWAN cough Again for the people in the back: T•A•I•W•A•N

Being an island nation is definitely an advantage in this regard.

not for UK evidently

Re: New restrictions in Hong Kong show that a single lockdown won’t be enough

#56
post #47

Technically this is clickbait - the title's implication is that we'll have more lockdowns in the future, while the article only talks about how the current lockdown will ebb and flow. If something is lifted and reinstated its really the same lockdown, not a new one. I was hoping to read an article about the potential of other coronaviruses or threats that may cause global lockdowns in the future.

Ir's arguably less clickbaity than saying that the lockdown is going to last for the next two years, which is the alternative framing.

Re: New restrictions in Hong Kong show that a single lockdown won’t be enough

#57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right, if there's a resurgence I'm not participating. The cure would be worse than the disease. I encourage susceptible populations to quarantine themselves, rather than everybody quarantining. We must work, date, and life must go on.

And this is why we need police or national guard to enforce lockdowns. And to charge people spreading the virus with felony murder and manslaughter charges, like they seem to be doing in extreme cases in Italy. I’ve seen some toxic comments on this site before, but nothing like someone blatantly saying “I’ll happy kill those around me to avoid any inconvenience to my daily routine”.

Your emotions are out of whack. Quotation marks are used for exact quotes, and nobody is saying anything remotely like that. I'm not going to continue to dive into the reasons I disagree with your argument. But that level of emotionality is incredibly tribal and counterproductive to the pursuit of truth.

Re: New restrictions in Hong Kong show that a single lockdown won’t be enough

#58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right, if there's a resurgence I'm not participating. The cure would be worse than the disease. I encourage susceptible populations to quarantine themselves, rather than everybody quarantining. We must work, date, and life must go on.

The cure would likely be worse than the disease for you . Are millions of people dying an acceptable trade-off for us to be able to date?

Only through meaningful antibody mass tests can we decide the true scope of the spread, thus the real numbers of fatality rate.

Economies couldn't wait for the cure, and vaccines mostly likely won't last long.

Re: New restrictions in Hong Kong show that a single lockdown won’t be enough

#59
post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

/r/Wallstreetbets just had someone put $775k, the person’s entire net worth, into options on the idea that the market will crash by 6/19. I am sure comments like yours give them hope that they are right. Personally, I think that the economy will change significantly, but crash vs recover for markets is different. If suddenly workers got a fair wage and everyone got universal healthcare we could easily see the country…

From a first principal perspective there is no reason why anyone should think that it is impossible for China or another country to create 2 billion vaccine doses in the next 6 months. There are plenty of reasons to say this will not happen but it isn't impossible. If it does happen everything flips very quickly.

Before administering a vaccine into everybody, we must first make sure it's not worse than the disease (on average, what is a very high var).

This test takes some time, so no, not on the next 6 months. One can realistically expect it by 2022, if we are willing to rush and accept some risk.

By the way, 6 months is how long it takes to create a batch of flu vaccines.

Re: New restrictions in Hong Kong show that a single lockdown won’t be enough

#60
post #9
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ll just give one example of how things will change — massive amounts of women are going to leave the workforce. Schools and day cares are not going to be reliable for the foreseeable future and women are more likely to quit their jobs and stay home if that becomes necessary.

There are significant second order effects (and 3rd, 4th degree effects and so on) that are difficult to foresee and accurately simulate. For example, just to continue on your train of thoughts, the number of average children in existing young families is going to go up, which is going to increase food consumption and, potentially decades later, construction activities in real estate.

> the number of average children in existing young families is going to go up

Intuitively, you'd expect that, but the data from previous epidemics show the opposite effect:

- http://www.populationassociation.org/wp-content/uploads/CAD_...

- https://ifstudies.org/blog/will-the-coronavirus-spike-births

Post reply on HN