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How the CDC’s restrictive testing guidelines hid the coronavirus epidemic

wsj.com

51–60 of 309 posts

Re: How the CDC’s restrictive testing guidelines hid the coronavirus epidemic

#51
post #5

The mask guidance is confusing as well. I get they are trying to preserve masks for medical staff. But, they also say it's mainly spread by coughing, sneezing, and resulting spray of bodily fluids. Surely even a scarf around your face would have some benefit? Yes, I get that the virus is small enough to pass through, but some deflection is better than none.

[deleted]

Re: How the CDC’s restrictive testing guidelines hid the coronavirus epidemic

#52

CDC has there shortcomings, no doubt but let’s not forget who’s truly to blame for the mess we’re in now. The trump administration’s disbandment of federal institutions created to combat this and the ongoing denial of a serious problem have led to a collapsing economy and isolation of millions. Good article here for sure but let’s not pass the blame to the CDC. We know who to blame...

Evidence? CDC has more funding than ever. And it's a myth trump got rid of the pandemic team at NSC. They just renamed it the bioterrorism team after people left. https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2020/mar/17/instagram-... https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2020/mar/12/joy-behar/...

You are spreading misinformation yourself. Even your own link doesn't support exactly what you just said. "Renaming" is not what happened.

Your link: https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2020/mar/17/instagram-...

Re: How the CDC’s restrictive testing guidelines hid the coronavirus epidemic

#53
post #3

https://archive.is/OHRXU

This gives me a Cloudflare DNS resolution error.

That’s because the owner of archive.is blocks DNS resolutions from Cloudflare DNS. They don’t actually use Cloudflare; rather, they have a grudge against Cloudflare, so they return an IP address belonging to Cloudflare when you attempt to resolve through 1.1.1.1. That makes it look as though it’s Cloudflare’s fault when it isn’t.

tl;dr archive.is wants Cloudflare to implement ECS, Cloudflare refused due to privacy concerns, archive.is doesn’t allow queries from 1.1.1.1 to resolve correctly.

Re: How the CDC’s restrictive testing guidelines hid the coronavirus epidemic

#54
post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Washington state just seized a restock from a Target in Seattle. https://twitter.com/GovInslee/status/1241505423259099136

It is not clear from the post whether they were seized or purchased by the state. There are (comparatively) plenty of financial resources around, just not a lot of masks.

they were purchased. the government does not just take property. in the end it may be the GSA price, which may not be the same as target was expecting to retail it at.

Re: How the CDC’s restrictive testing guidelines hid the coronavirus epidemic

#55
post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's very irritating because people don't understand the concept of defense in depth. Are surgical masks going to give you total protection? Of course not, but as you say they provide SOME benefit. Saying "masks don't work because they don't fully stop the virus and users misuse them" is basically equivalent to saying "code review is a waste of time because it won't catch every bug and because devs don't do it correc…

If there are two "mental tools" I wish we could teach every person, they are exponential growth and statistical thinking. Neither is intuitive, but they would help people understand this whole situation (and many others) a lot better.

My high school math teacher introduced exponential growth by asking the class if we'd take $1M now or $0.01 doubled daily for a month. We, as most people do, wanted the $1M, but the penny turns into more than $5M.

Had to explain this to someone yesterday. They literally wouldn't believe me until I screenshotted an Excel spreadsheet of the daily doublings, despite a finance degree.

Re: How the CDC’s restrictive testing guidelines hid the coronavirus epidemic

#56
post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's very irritating because people don't understand the concept of defense in depth. Are surgical masks going to give you total protection? Of course not, but as you say they provide SOME benefit. Saying "masks don't work because they don't fully stop the virus and users misuse them" is basically equivalent to saying "code review is a waste of time because it won't catch every bug and because devs don't do it correc…

What's more frustrating is the exact same logic applies to "social distancing." Social distancing will not completely stop people from getting sick. It'll just slow the spread. So, according to the CDC, an imperfect solution for quarantine is totally fine, but when it comes to masks, only n95 or better are worth pursuing.

It's quite likely that in all the scenarios a mask may have a useful effect, N95 or better is the only time it works.

For medical professionals in close contact with patients and dealing with airborne-protocol pathogens (which is what a droplet-mediated pathogens like SARS2 becomes classed as once patients are coughing and being intubated) then a bad mask is quite probably worse then no mask (this has precedent: ineffective masks obstruct breathing, which makes you take deeper breaths and draw more particles in deeper in your lungs - it's a big problem when dealing with fine dusts in construction).

Re: How the CDC’s restrictive testing guidelines hid the coronavirus epidemic

#57
post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right now it’s paradoxical: according to the government, masks are useless for civilians, but essential to medical personnel.

There is a resolution to the paradox. Masks do work (especially when worn correctly), but the net-optimal place to put them to work is keeping medical personnel up and functional. Have spare masks? We are trying to get them to the people who need them most: https://findthemasks.com/ We are presently listing hospitals accepting small-scale donations in 28 states, growing fast.

That's not a resolution because the claim is that they're useless ("not effective"), which is not the same as there existing a better use. They could have communicated the truth, instead they chose to lie, which erodes trust.

https://twitter.com/Surgeon_General/status/12337257852839321...

Re: How the CDC’s restrictive testing guidelines hid the coronavirus epidemic

#58
post #5

The mask guidance is confusing as well. I get they are trying to preserve masks for medical staff. But, they also say it's mainly spread by coughing, sneezing, and resulting spray of bodily fluids. Surely even a scarf around your face would have some benefit? Yes, I get that the virus is small enough to pass through, but some deflection is better than none.

I found a few links on making "ninja" masks out of t-shirts. They seem as good as any. The best thing is you can just throw them in the washing machine after an outing. https://www.wikihow.com/Make-a-Ninja-Mask http://www.funlol.com/1255/Ninja_Instructions!.html

“Origami” tea cloth mask with rubber bands https://www.instagram.com/p/B96rcR8neYv/

Re: How the CDC’s restrictive testing guidelines hid the coronavirus epidemic

#59
post #56
post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's more frustrating is the exact same logic applies to "social distancing." Social distancing will not completely stop people from getting sick. It'll just slow the spread. So, according to the CDC, an imperfect solution for quarantine is totally fine, but when it comes to masks, only n95 or better are worth pursuing.

It's quite likely that in all the scenarios a mask may have a useful effect, N95 or better is the only time it works. For medical professionals in close contact with patients and dealing with airborne-protocol pathogens (which is what a droplet-mediated pathogens like SARS2 becomes classed as once patients are coughing and being intubated) then a bad mask is quite probably worse then no mask (this has precedent: inef…

It's highly likely that even basic surgical masks have some impact. A fit-tested N95 is the gold standard, but the widespread use of surgical masks in Asia during the SARS epidemic does seem to have had an impact.

https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/10/2/03-0730_article

Re: How the CDC’s restrictive testing guidelines hid the coronavirus epidemic

#60
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The whole blaming people for hoarding masks and then the "masks don't work" things have been incredibly frustrating. It is almost like authorities didn't want anyone to start asking why the public couldn't get masks, as they can in say Taiwan. Most (if not all) distributors and manufacturers of masks has been prioritizing health care systems and governments over retailers since January. Just as they should do. Were t…

Washington state just seized a restock from a Target in Seattle. https://twitter.com/GovInslee/status/1241505423259099136

I really want to hear the back story on this. Who is the distributor? Why did they end up at a Target? I'm betting the distributor tried to sell them to hospitals but the hospitals said they weren't appropriate/certified for medical use so couldn't take them? Not much to go on from a tweet but definitely needs investigating.
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