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Air-Traffic Control Is in the Midst of a Major Change from Radar to GPS

wsj.com

51–60 of 197 posts

Re: Air-Traffic Control Is in the Midst of a Major Change from Radar to GPS

#51
post #41

What's the point in posting an article which has a paywall? Does anyone have a link which points to an open version of the article?

I pay for the Wall Street Journal, so had no trouble reading the article.

Not everything in life is free.

Re: Air-Traffic Control Is in the Midst of a Major Change from Radar to GPS

#52
A valuable part of the ADS-B out mandate is that planes even as small as mine (a.k.a. tiny) can cheaply (<200$US) pick up ADS-B in and display it on a consumer tablet. My private airplanes now have pseudo radar. Not every airplane in the air is broadcasting, but most are. This is a huge safety win. Almost without exception I'll see airplanes on my tablet long before I have visual on them.

Re: Air-Traffic Control Is in the Midst of a Major Change from Radar to GPS

#54
post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Radar has been jammed in the past by accident , since home routers now operate on the same band. See https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2015/09/fcc-a... . 5G coming in doesn't improve matters. GPS is actually reserved, so there's going to be a lot less accidental interference.

>GPS is actually reserved, so there's going to be a lot less accidental interference. that's only a plus if you're not expecting malicious interference . how much harder is radar to spoof compared to GPS?

Well some stealth is base on spoofing part of a radar return. Absorb as much of the incoming radar as possible and alter the reflection using a phased array. So its not impossible just more expensive.

According to the crew on the USS Zumwalt they can make a 600' ship look as large as a cruise ship or as small as a fishing vessel. This ship is covered in radar absorbent materials and has a giant phased array to accomplish this.

Re: Air-Traffic Control Is in the Midst of a Major Change from Radar to GPS

#55
post #8

To an extent, this sounds terrifying. The first thing that jumped to my mind is that GPS be jammed or spoofed. In fact, the U.S. military in its shift away from COIN to great power competition in possibly highly contested environments is training to have less reliance on GPS: https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-01-26/usaf-begins-massiv... Radar can be jammed too, but I would guess the EM signature powerful enough to…

This isn't about throwing away radar, it's about augmenting the current system with more accurate data for better and safer management of airspace. Most airplanes already rely heavily on GPS for their own navigation. If GPS is being jammed (or having any other clear issue) they'll fall back to their many other redundant navigation instruments. If you want to be scared, be scared about spoofing of ILS signals, where a…

> This isn't about throwing away radar, ...

*all radar.

Certainly around airports radar will be kept, but there are a few (remote?) places where aging infrastructure will not be replaced.

On the plus side, there are areas that had no coverage (Gulf of Mexico) which now get traffic information from receivers that are easier to run than radar towers.

Re: Air-Traffic Control Is in the Midst of a Major Change from Radar to GPS

#56

I worked for a firm, which studied satellite navigation and implementation for air traffic control, guidance, safety, and ILS. I don't think that will ever happen. There are huge gaping issues with GPS, both WAAS and GBAS. It's very unreliable, especially in bad weather. The old-school RF tower and ILS, which used Carrier frequency pairings by the runway, are way more reliable and propagate bad weather while guiding…

Why do truckers have GPS jammers?

You either didn't see the comma or you're joking

Re: Air-Traffic Control Is in the Midst of a Major Change from Radar to GPS

#57

I worked for a firm, which studied satellite navigation and implementation for air traffic control, guidance, safety, and ILS. I don't think that will ever happen. There are huge gaping issues with GPS, both WAAS and GBAS. It's very unreliable, especially in bad weather. The old-school RF tower and ILS, which used Carrier frequency pairings by the runway, are way more reliable and propagate bad weather while guiding…

Why do truckers have GPS jammers?

https://gizmodo.com/jamming-gps-signals-is-illegal-dangerous...

> he’s seen truckers trying to avoid paying highway tolls, employees blocking their bosses from tracking their cars, high school kids using them to fly drones in a restricted area, and even, he believes, undercover police officers using them to avoid tails

Re: Air-Traffic Control Is in the Midst of a Major Change from Radar to GPS

#58

I worked for a firm, which studied satellite navigation and implementation for air traffic control, guidance, safety, and ILS. I don't think that will ever happen. There are huge gaping issues with GPS, both WAAS and GBAS. It's very unreliable, especially in bad weather. The old-school RF tower and ILS, which used Carrier frequency pairings by the runway, are way more reliable and propagate bad weather while guiding…

Why do truckers have GPS jammers?

To defeat "the Qualcomm", which records hours. This may let them drive longer than the DOT allows.

Re: Air-Traffic Control Is in the Midst of a Major Change from Radar to GPS

#59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why do truckers have GPS jammers?

You either didn't see the comma or you're joking

I'm pretty sure I parsed it correctly. It's "Truckers (with GPS jammers) who drive my airports...". Parsing it as a list means it no longer makes sense.

Re: Air-Traffic Control Is in the Midst of a Major Change from Radar to GPS

#60
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The cost. This affects general aviation as older planes will require avionics upgrades. Otherwise I’m excited for the sheer amount of data that will be made available to the public. Now you will be able to track all FAA registered planes

Have you seen any official discussion of the data being made available? I feel like, for example, I'd be worried if fine-detail GPS data was being published live for example, or live enough to predict where the plane is "right" now...

It's been live for years.

https://flightaware.com/live/

Any time my dad takes his personal plane up for an hour's flight, I get a text message and can watch his track (and altitude/speed) in real-time.

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