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Finland is the only EU country where homelessness is in decline

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Re: Finland is the only EU country where homelessness is in decline

#51

Post by huffmsa »

throwlaplace wrote: post #39
metalrain wrote: post #27

While homelessness might be in decline and shelters have more capacity, you can still find people sleeping on the floors of public pay-per-use toilets in Finland. So no, homelessness is not ended and probably never will be.

Lol and polio and measles will never be eradicated either because we still have cases. oh wait there's a reason why they haven't been eradicated hmmmmm.

Bad analogy. If the fins were actively rounding up homeless and forcing them into shelters, or disposing of them, then you'd have a case.

Re: Finland is the only EU country where homelessness is in decline

#52

Post by Gravityloss »

gamblor956 wrote: post #22
maxharris wrote: post #2

To help contextualize this so I understand the situation better, can someone compare and contrast what treatment for debilitating mental health issues such as schizophrenia looks like in Finland vs. the US? The second issue is, In the last 10 years, the “Housing First” programme provided 4,600 homes in Finland. In 2017 there were still about 1,900 people living on the streets . In the US, there are something like hal…

They never had Reagan, so they still treat mental illness there. More importantly, Finland allows for the involuntary commitment if the mentally ill. In the US, this is only allowed if the individual presents a danger to themselves or others.

There was a massive change from institutional care to ambulatory care at the start of the 90:s, coinciding with the severe recession. Basically a big resource cut. I don't think it was ever reversed. (Don't know much about the sector.)

Re: Finland is the only EU country where homelessness is in decline

#53

Post by dang »

metalrain wrote: post #27

While homelessness might be in decline and shelters have more capacity, you can still find people sleeping on the floors of public pay-per-use toilets in Finland. So no, homelessness is not ended and probably never will be.

We've replaced the baity headline with the less baity headline, in accordance with the HN guidelines.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: Finland is the only EU country where homelessness is in decline

#54

Post by ahelwer »

Bostonian wrote: post #26

"Those affected by homelessness receive a small apartment and counselling – without any preconditions." I doubt it will work in Finland in the long run, and even if it does, Finland and the U.S. have very different populations. Most Americans work to put a roof over their head, and it's unfair to them to "unconditionally" give some people housing. It's also a big disincentive to work. The current unemployment rate is…

So would you say you're happy & satisfied to live in a society where people must work under threat of dying in the streets? Try to imagine a better world. People should work because they choose to, not at gunpoint.

I don't feel it's unfair that someone is given a house, even though I "worked for it" (among many other factors which culminated in my not being homeless). Would you mind unpacking why you feel that way?

Re: Finland is the only EU country where homelessness is in decline

#55

Post by TheSpiceIsLife »

calmworm wrote: post #45
throwlaplace wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lol and polio and measles will never be eradicated either because we still have cases. oh wait there's a reason why they haven't been eradicated hmmmmm.

I don’t see the connection. What is the point you are trying to make here?

Maybe a homelessness vaccine?

Re: Finland is the only EU country where homelessness is in decline

#56

Post by splitrocket »

Bostonian wrote: post #26

"Those affected by homelessness receive a small apartment and counselling – without any preconditions." I doubt it will work in Finland in the long run, and even if it does, Finland and the U.S. have very different populations. Most Americans work to put a roof over their head, and it's unfair to them to "unconditionally" give some people housing. It's also a big disincentive to work. The current unemployment rate is…

Your premise is incorrect: it originated in the US and is the single most effective, lowest cost method we have to address homelessness[1].

It is, in fact, cheaper than shelter [2].

"People not contributing to society"? Really? Perhaps if they had a home they could get a job? I invite you to go to an actual homeless shelter near you and talk to the people there. Ask them what it's like to try to find a job while living in a shelter.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Housing_First#Evidence_and_out... [2] https://www.centerforhealthjournalism.org/resources/lessons/...

Re: Finland is the only EU country where homelessness is in decline

#57

Post by onetimemanytime »

metalrain wrote: post #27

While homelessness might be in decline and shelters have more capacity, you can still find people sleeping on the floors of public pay-per-use toilets in Finland. So no, homelessness is not ended and probably never will be.

even if the state gave everyone a free home, a lot of people would still be homeless due to mental illness, not being used to managing "normal" life etc. etc.

Re: Finland is the only EU country where homelessness is in decline

#58

Post by agumonkey »

metalrain wrote: post #27

While homelessness might be in decline and shelters have more capacity, you can still find people sleeping on the floors of public pay-per-use toilets in Finland. So no, homelessness is not ended and probably never will be.

I'd be interested in having some stats about why people live outside alone. I think that there are some that have decided to quit normal life for emotional reasons and that they do not want shelter or a way back (probably after too many disappointments or traumas).

But for the rest it's good that a country is doing a large effort. Most of them need a few to get back on their feet: shelter, hygiene and safety.

Re: Finland is the only EU country where homelessness is in decline

#59

Post by SpicyLemonZest »

splitrocket wrote: post #41
gridlockd wrote: post #16

The headline is factually wrong. The truth is that Finland has reduced the population of homeless by 35% over ten years[1]. While I applaud easing the bureaucratic hurdles in giving people access to homes, in many cases not being offered a home is not the reason why people are homeless. It's simply not "as easy as that". [1] https://www.theguardian.com/cities/2019/jun/03/its-a-miracle...

Logically, your argument is baffling on its face: homelessness is literally the condition of not having a home. Giving someone a home literally solves the problem. All that said, "Housing First" is the most effective, lowest cost, evidence based program we have to substantially lower homelessness. It works, and it's vastly cheaper than both the status quo ( https://www.centerforhealthjournalism.org/resources/lessons/…

The article mentions that 1900 people still live on the streets and 1 in 5 homeless people will not be able to keep their Housing First flat. It would appear that Housing First has not been able to solve their problem.

Re: Finland is the only EU country where homelessness is in decline

#60

Post by ASlave2Gravity »

at-fates-hands wrote: post #28

For some perspective: Finalnd's military budget: 300 million US military budget: 700 BILLION The US could dump a lot of money into these social services to address people who are homeless, drug addicts, and other people on the fringes of society. We are however, constantly put in a place where other nations depend on us for their security. As such, they don't have to have a massive defensive budget when they can rely…

But isn't the US hegemony all about dictating global markets, ect. ? So whilst the US might be ensuring other nation's security, it is also ensuring that the markets are in its desired condition. This modus operandi, I suppose, means that the US homeless will suffer more, as those desired conditions are desired by the people who are able to control the military decisions, and not the homeless, who would most likely want cheaper health care & housing.
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