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Shopify CEO says long hours aren't necessary for success

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Re: Shopify CEO says long hours aren't necessary for success

#51

Post by CydeWeys »

dvt wrote: post #43
zarkov99 wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is anecdotal information that he does indeed do what he claims. And he is the most impressive CEO in this generation, perhaps in history, so long hours must work for some people.

> ... he is the most impressive CEO in this generation, perhaps in history How anyone can say this with a straight face blows my mind when even in the tech vertical he has some serious competition (are we forgetting about Jeff Bezos, Larry Page, Sergey Brin, Bill Gates, Steve Jobs, etc.), let alone actual historical figures like Henry Ford, John Rockefeller, Cornelius Vanderbilt, etc.

It's too early to judge. If he accomplishes his goal of establishing permanent and self-sustaining human settlements on other worlds then he may end up being the most important person ever, not just CEO.

His goals, at least, are ambitious in a way that those of the other people you mentioned aren't (except possibly Bezos, but Bezos doesn't laser focus on this stuff the same way Musk does).

Re: Shopify CEO says long hours aren't necessary for success

#52

Post by Aunche »

bwb wrote: post #28

I don't believe anyone really does 80 hours. I just don't think it is possible and I don't think you can call sitting at a desk doing nothing "work". I've done 60 hours during intense periods just fine... but it was only effective because of the nature of the work I was doing at the time. And, I usually took a break down the road to compensate. In no way was it even 50% creative work. 4 to 6 creative hours seems righ…

A lot of surgeons have 80 hour workweeks. This is especially common is smaller hospitals in rural areas. It's not all surgery, but they're definitely not sitting at their desks and doing nothing. Before regulations, it was not uncommon for some doctors to work over 100 hours because they were in such high demand.

Re: Shopify CEO says long hours aren't necessary for success

#53

Post by embit »

CydeWeys wrote: post #42
bwb wrote: post #28

I don't believe anyone really does 80 hours. I just don't think it is possible and I don't think you can call sitting at a desk doing nothing "work". I've done 60 hours during intense periods just fine... but it was only effective because of the nature of the work I was doing at the time. And, I usually took a break down the road to compensate. In no way was it even 50% creative work. 4 to 6 creative hours seems righ…

Totally agree with this. To give an example, in the months ahead of launching .app (which I was the tech lead of), I was pulling some 50-60 hour work-weeks vs a typical 40. That was exhausting and definitely the maximum I was capable of pulling (talking about actual hours of work here, not just hours spent in the office). Plus, post-launch, I took things easy for a couple months to recover.

Agreed. I can do more than 40 hours of intense focused work not more than once a quarter.

Re: Shopify CEO says long hours aren't necessary for success

#54

Post by daok »

abledon wrote: post #44
pastor_elm wrote: post #17

Shopify is obsessed with growth like every other public company. They are nothing like Basecamp. They can get away with shorter hours, maybe, because Canadian salaries are relatively low compared to San Francisco, but something will eventually have to give.

whats the average hours for FAANG in SV? 60-65 ?

The average is probably around 45. 60-65 are the high hand numbers. Some people in SV do less than 40 real hours of work, a lot 40-45 and some do a few days/weeks of a stretch above 50h but let's not fall into the fallacy that everyone is working +60 hours all the time.

Re: Shopify CEO says long hours aren't necessary for success

#55

Post by ivl »

dang wrote: post #41
IB885588 wrote: post #2

Original thread on twitter: https://twitter.com/tobi/status/1210242184341000192?s=20

Thanks! We changed the URL to that from https://www.businessinsider.com/shopify-ceo-success-long-hou... , which is mostly just reporting on it. What does the s=20 do?

> What does the s=20 do?

Seems to be tacked on by Twitter to track the source of shares. Pretty sure the number changes by device.

Re: Shopify CEO says long hours aren't necessary for success

#56

Post by shanemlk »

zarkov99 wrote: post #39
dvt wrote: post #26

What's unfortunate is that on the other side of the coin, "rockstar CEOs" like Elon Musk claim they sleep 4 hours a night and work 90 hour weeks. I think Musk does this mostly for publicity/image reasons and not that it's actually true, but you've got plenty of wantapreneurs parroting this (imo) unhealthy lifestyle.

There is anecdotal information that he does indeed do what he claims. And he is the most impressive CEO in this generation, perhaps in history, so long hours must work for some people.

CEO is different from employee with no stake in the company. Sure, he probably does spend 80+ hours on his companies, but he's enjoying it. He's not beholden to any expectations of a manager. He's spending time reading/exploring/chatting and including that as 90 hours of work. Musk has no line drawn between work and play. I think Musk flaunts this public image to encourage a breakdown of work and play, not to say you should spend 90 hours checking boxes your manager gave you.

Re: Shopify CEO says long hours aren't necessary for success

#57

Post by lr4444lr »

Aunche wrote: post #52
bwb wrote: post #28

I don't believe anyone really does 80 hours. I just don't think it is possible and I don't think you can call sitting at a desk doing nothing "work". I've done 60 hours during intense periods just fine... but it was only effective because of the nature of the work I was doing at the time. And, I usually took a break down the road to compensate. In no way was it even 50% creative work. 4 to 6 creative hours seems righ…

A lot of surgeons have 80 hour workweeks. This is especially common is smaller hospitals in rural areas. It's not all surgery, but they're definitely not sitting at their desks and doing nothing. Before regulations, it was not uncommon for some doctors to work over 100 hours because they were in such high demand.

For how much of that time are they actually performing the specialized work or at least decision making that only they can do?

Re: Shopify CEO says long hours aren't necessary for success

#58

Post by mikeg8 »

dvt wrote: post #43
zarkov99 wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is anecdotal information that he does indeed do what he claims. And he is the most impressive CEO in this generation, perhaps in history, so long hours must work for some people.

> ... he is the most impressive CEO in this generation, perhaps in history How anyone can say this with a straight face blows my mind when even in the tech vertical he has some serious competition (are we forgetting about Jeff Bezos, Larry Page, Sergey Brin, Bill Gates, Steve Jobs, etc.), let alone actual historical figures like Henry Ford, John Rockefeller, Cornelius Vanderbilt, etc.

>How anyone can say this with a straight face blows my mind

Elon is the only person to ever start four 1bn+ companies (paypal, tesla, SpaceX, Solarcity). He has/is driving innovation across multiple industries on a time scale that I don't think any of the people you mentioned can really touch, not to mention hyperloop and the Boring Company. Its not even debatable IMO.

Re: Shopify CEO says long hours aren't necessary for success

#59

Post by droopyEyelids »

Aunche wrote: post #52
bwb wrote: post #28

I don't believe anyone really does 80 hours. I just don't think it is possible and I don't think you can call sitting at a desk doing nothing "work". I've done 60 hours during intense periods just fine... but it was only effective because of the nature of the work I was doing at the time. And, I usually took a break down the road to compensate. In no way was it even 50% creative work. 4 to 6 creative hours seems righ…

A lot of surgeons have 80 hour workweeks. This is especially common is smaller hospitals in rural areas. It's not all surgery, but they're definitely not sitting at their desks and doing nothing. Before regulations, it was not uncommon for some doctors to work over 100 hours because they were in such high demand.

This doesn't exactly address the point.

Human beings are only capable of sustained attention for limited periods of time, plus they have biological needs and must navigate a physical world.

Now, if you're just talking about time on the clock, then sure- 168 hours is the limit per week. But we're talking about people doing productive, mentally demanding work. 80 hours might not be possible.

Re: Shopify CEO says long hours aren't necessary for success

#60

Post by bdcravens »

zarkov99 wrote: post #39
dvt wrote: post #26

What's unfortunate is that on the other side of the coin, "rockstar CEOs" like Elon Musk claim they sleep 4 hours a night and work 90 hour weeks. I think Musk does this mostly for publicity/image reasons and not that it's actually true, but you've got plenty of wantapreneurs parroting this (imo) unhealthy lifestyle.

There is anecdotal information that he does indeed do what he claims. And he is the most impressive CEO in this generation, perhaps in history, so long hours must work for some people.

Or his sleep patterns are completely orthogonal to his success.
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