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Infosys shares drop to 10-month low as whistle-blowers target CEO

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Re: Infosys shares drop to 10-month low as whistle-blowers target CEO

#51

Post by TeMPOraL »

r_singh wrote: post #50
TeMPOraL wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If there's a knowingly broken process, both sides of it are to blame. One party for using a broken process, the other for exploiting it. Imagine you own a store with broken locks. A thief learns of that, and comes one night, and plunders your store. Yes, you'd be to blame for being irresponsible and stupid. But the thief would still be liable for theft.

By this example, fraud is rampant across business[1], not just outsourcing. Facebook, VW, Theranos and many many more.

Never said it isn't. Big and small. The amount of shit I've experienced myself, or had reported to me by friends and acquaintances is so large that I have a very low starting opinion on small businesses on things not strongly enforced by law. I've shared some more egregious examples on HN a few times, like a practice in grocery stores to wash stale meat with dish cleaner to be able to sell it as fresh. Yes, fraud is very much rampant across business.

Re: Infosys shares drop to 10-month low as whistle-blowers target CEO

#52

Post by hc91 »

r_singh wrote: post #35

I see a lot of comments here attributing outsourcing firms to fraud. Let's remember that these cos. win contracts fair and square by taking advantage of myopic tendering processes. If there's something to blame then it's obsolete tender process that make it impossible for quality vendors to compete or for outsourcing firms to make realising proposals. Overpromising and underdelivering is not fraud. Fraud is what VW,…

Dude, you are obviously biased and try to portray the "pure play" companies in a positive light. Stop it, you are not fooling anyone. Stop defending them, those companies are the literal cancer of the software engineering world from the most literal point of view and the people in this thread talking bad things about them are doing that because they have very good reasons to.

Re: Infosys shares drop to 10-month low as whistle-blowers target CEO

#53

Post by kalesh »

My early years were in a big outsourcing firm & man everything was delayed & over budget. 3 months of development became 9 months. Projects promised in 6 months took 1 year of development. Projects with older technologies like VB - which worked quite well, code was clean were rewritten for no benefit whatsoever. These rewrites were sold by marketing people. People were overbilled everywhere.

Glad I left the Indian corporate scene & started working remotely. Now I run a small remote QA team for an international firm at 30-40% less cost & delivering at least 2x times these corporate giants.

Re: Infosys shares drop to 10-month low as whistle-blowers target CEO

#54

Post by hc91 »

lev272 wrote: post #6
rsj_hn wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Brands aren't determined by how much wall street loves the firm, but by how much customers like the firm. In the actual industry it's in -- that of H1B visa mills -- it doesn't have a particularly good reputation for producing good code. It also has been plagued by scandals in India, and has a poor reputation in the eyes of immigration authorities as well.

Who are the most highly regarded of the firms in Infosys's field? I realize that might sound sarcastic, but I mean it sincerely. I have little experience with that world, but I wasn't aware there was a hierarchy of brands in the offshore consulting firm space. Now I'm curious

All of the firms in Infosys's field are the running joke of the software engineering world. There is literally not one of them viewed in a positive or even neutral light. And yes, there is a hierarchy of brands in the offshore consulting firm space and the Indian consultancies are the bottom of the barrel.

Re: Infosys shares drop to 10-month low as whistle-blowers target CEO

#55

Post by acdha »

RcouF1uZ4gsC wrote: post #2

> The allegations “could severely damage the company’s pristine brand if true, especially in the IT services industry,” Bloomberg Intelligence analyst Anurag Rana wrote Bloomberg must have a different definition of "pristine brand" than a lot of programmers I have met.

Programmers do not hire Infosys. Senior management does and their reputation is different there: those complaining programmers are just trying to protect their turf, the cost savings are compelling, etc. and there are a million ways to spin the inevitable failed projects.

Re: Infosys shares drop to 10-month low as whistle-blowers target CEO

#56

Post by peteradio »

r_singh wrote: post #35

I see a lot of comments here attributing outsourcing firms to fraud. Let's remember that these cos. win contracts fair and square by taking advantage of myopic tendering processes. If there's something to blame then it's obsolete tender process that make it impossible for quality vendors to compete or for outsourcing firms to make realising proposals. Overpromising and underdelivering is not fraud. Fraud is what VW,…

Are you being hired to apologize for these shitty consulting giants? Up and down this thread like its your job.

Re: Infosys shares drop to 10-month low as whistle-blowers target CEO

#57

Post by bhouston »

r_singh wrote: post #35

I see a lot of comments here attributing outsourcing firms to fraud. Let's remember that these cos. win contracts fair and square by taking advantage of myopic tendering processes. If there's something to blame then it's obsolete tender process that make it impossible for quality vendors to compete or for outsourcing firms to make realising proposals. Overpromising and underdelivering is not fraud. Fraud is what VW,…

One of the issues creating poor impressions of Indians at least in Canada nearly every resident gets a fairly regular stream of calls from Pakistan and India that are actually fraud, dealing with IT and credit cards, duct cleaning and taxes.

I think India is a challenging place to make a living and thus many people do whatever they can to make a buck, at least that is how I explain this behavior to myself.

Re: Infosys shares drop to 10-month low as whistle-blowers target CEO

#58

Post by hereiskkb »

r_singh wrote: post #37
close04 wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Doing it with the intention of underdelivering and ballooning costs and time to make more money is fraud though. And make no mistake, no outsourcing company goes to a tender intending to be on time and on budget. It’s not good business for them.

And just how commonly do we see such[1] fraud across any business or industry? Cough , pharmaceutical cos, doctors, social media & search giants, car manufacturing giants. Any of these ring a bell? [1]As in, the above (your) definition of fraud i.e. misleading customers, by deliberately under delivering and over promising. With this definition, many businesses and accepted practices are fraud. IMO, true fraud is what…

That is just whataboutism. "What about this field?" "What about that cos?"

All of it is fraud. Regardless. Promising results with the intention of not sticking to it is fraud.

Re: Infosys shares drop to 10-month low as whistle-blowers target CEO

#59

Post by hereiskkb »

r_singh wrote: post #50
TeMPOraL wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If there's a knowingly broken process, both sides of it are to blame. One party for using a broken process, the other for exploiting it. Imagine you own a store with broken locks. A thief learns of that, and comes one night, and plunders your store. Yes, you'd be to blame for being irresponsible and stupid. But the thief would still be liable for theft.

By this example, fraud is rampant across business[1], not just outsourcing. Facebook, VW, Theranos and many many more.

Yep. It is. Fraud across the spectrum.

Re: Infosys shares drop to 10-month low as whistle-blowers target CEO

#60

Post by hereiskkb »

r_singh wrote: post #35

I see a lot of comments here attributing outsourcing firms to fraud. Let's remember that these cos. win contracts fair and square by taking advantage of myopic tendering processes. If there's something to blame then it's obsolete tender process that make it impossible for quality vendors to compete or for outsourcing firms to make realising proposals. Overpromising and underdelivering is not fraud. Fraud is what VW,…

> Overpromising and underdelivering is not fraud.

It is. That's like saying selling a Merc with a Suzuki Swift engine inside is not fraud.

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