Joi Ito Resigns from M.I.T. Media Lab After Outcry over Jeffrey Epstein Ties • Hacker News Board

Re: Joi Ito Resigns from M.I.T. Media Lab After Outcry over Jeffrey Epstein Ties

#51

Post by Retric » Sat, Sep 07, 2019, 8:22 PM UTC

nullc wrote: post #20

jpmattia wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Taking money from a dirty source is one thing; hiding it from the university because they've blacklisted that person in particular is about as unforgivable a crime as you'll find in academia TBH, I've never heard of a blacklisted donor at MIT, so I'm a little surprised (pleasantly, as an alum).

I'm confused by the blacklisted donor thing. The first questions I had when reading about it was "when did he end up on this list?", "why did he end up on it?, and "how big is this list?" It doesn't seem like any of the journalists even asked. That sounds like a very interesting story in and of itself.

Yea, I suspect his prior conviction for “solicitation of prostitution involving a minor” may have played a part. But, the details could be interesting.

Re: Joi Ito Resigns from M.I.T. Media Lab After Outcry over Jeffrey Epstein Ties

#52

Post by ryanlol » Sat, Sep 07, 2019, 8:23 PM UTC

crispyambulance wrote: post #41

> I don't get it. This is one of those things where somebody noticed that things just didn't seem right and the proper response to that is to raise concern and ask questions. Sorry, but a 60-something "finance" guy with an entourage of teen models doesn't add up. Sure some of these people have trophy wives half their age, and it raises eyebrows, but this is far beyond that and totally unacceptable once somebody looks…

>Sorry, but a 60-something "finance" guy with an entourage of teen models doesn't add up

Honestly, it sounds like you just don’t go out very much.

Re: Joi Ito Resigns from M.I.T. Media Lab After Outcry over Jeffrey Epstein Ties

#53

Post by matz1 » Sat, Sep 07, 2019, 8:23 PM UTC

IvyMike wrote: post #13

In the other thread, people were saying "I'd take Epstein's dirty money and do good with it." But the problem is that doing so normalizes the behavior. Everybody who has doubts about working with the creep looks around the room, and when they don't see anyone else objecting, ends up thinking "I guess we're all ok with this behavior" and goes along to get along.

Normalize the taking money? Maybe, but not the child trafficking part.

Re: Joi Ito Resigns from M.I.T. Media Lab After Outcry over Jeffrey Epstein Ties

#54

Post by FireBeyond » Sat, Sep 07, 2019, 8:23 PM UTC

tempsy wrote: post #44

FireBeyond wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Leaving aside this particular situation... Many philanthropists will say "I wish to donate $X", and then ask a friend/group/organization, "Where would you like me to donate this?", hence a "directed donation".

Gates is denying Epstein was involved in this donation at all, despite the emails. Plus, Gates was well aware how unsavery Epstein was given his insistence the donation be made anonymously. Doesn't add up.

"Leaving aside this particular situation".

I was just responding to your question of why a rich person "needs" someone to be a middleman on where to donate.

Re: Joi Ito Resigns from M.I.T. Media Lab After Outcry over Jeffrey Epstein Ties

#55

Post by soulofmischief » Sat, Sep 07, 2019, 8:24 PM UTC

This article is filled with strangely matter-of-fact language regarding matters which are still unsolved:

For example:

> Mr. Epstein — who killed himself in jail last month while facing federal sex trafficking charges

Re: Joi Ito Resigns from M.I.T. Media Lab After Outcry over Jeffrey Epstein Ties

#56

Post by liability » Sat, Sep 07, 2019, 8:24 PM UTC

krapp wrote: post #32

IvyMike wrote: post #13

In the other thread, people were saying "I'd take Epstein's dirty money and do good with it." But the problem is that doing so normalizes the behavior. Everybody who has doubts about working with the creep looks around the room, and when they don't see anyone else objecting, ends up thinking "I guess we're all ok with this behavior" and goes along to get along.

> Everybody who has doubts about working with the creep looks around the room, and when they don't see anyone else objecting, ends up thinking "I guess we're all ok with this behavior" and gets along to go along. Let's be honest - a lot of people in the tech community and related subcultures (particularly genre fandoms) are either ok with, or are ambivalent towards, this behavior, or have a lack of empathy which lead…

It's a trait that I've heard derisively referred to as "engineer autism" in some circles, though I doubt the literal truth of that description. But whatever it's called or ascribed to, there seems to be a genuine underlying trend of some sort. It's a topic I'd like to see defined and addressed; as tech becomes more important to society the pathologies of engineer types become more and more socially relevant as people with those traits acquire more power and status.

Re: Joi Ito Resigns from M.I.T. Media Lab After Outcry over Jeffrey Epstein Ties

#57

Post by turtlecloud » Sat, Sep 07, 2019, 8:25 PM UTC

ajross wrote: post #28

jakelazaroff wrote: post #3

Good. Here’s a particularly damning passage from Ronan Farrow’s New Yorker article [1]: > According to Swenson, Ito had informed Cohen that Epstein “never goes into any room without his two female ‘assistants,’ ” whom he wanted to bring to the meeting at the Media Lab. Swenson objected to this, too, and it was decided that the assistants would be allowed to accompany Epstein but would wait outside the meeting room. >…

Relevant to that quote, it's important to point out that this kind of influence peddling fell apart, not when Epstein himself got caught, but when enough people at a high level decided they didn't want to be part of it. Ito himself clearly viewed himself as a kind of fellow traveller in Epstein's world (no idea if that involves sex trafficing! That's not my point!). Gates did too. But Signe Swenson wasn't as willing…

Herero men is irrelevant. If the situation had been reversed with gay men then it would be young boys instead.

Re: Joi Ito Resigns from M.I.T. Media Lab After Outcry over Jeffrey Epstein Ties

#58

Post by nexuist » Sat, Sep 07, 2019, 8:26 PM UTC

liability wrote: post #34

nf8nnfufuu wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry, I don't get it. Somebody having assistants who look like models and are from Eastern Europe is suspicious of trafficking women? How? Why? I have heard about Epstein, obviously with hindsight all sorts of things he did can be seen in a new light. I just don't understand what is so damning about the passage above. Would somebody who is trafficking women really take them everywhere he goes? I thought it would be…

I can't figure out why anybody would think Epstein's previous criminal conviction was irrelevant to the matter of Epstein's reputation. I'm trying to assume good faith, but it's not easy.

Not everyone works from the same knowledge base. OP could have heard about Epstein in passing, per se, and not known about his extensive criminal history or previous arrest/trial.

I only know about these things from Reddit posters and not much else. There is probably a whole host of information you and I do not know about him; it's important to be aware of your blind spots but also the blind spots of others.

Re: Joi Ito Resigns from M.I.T. Media Lab After Outcry over Jeffrey Epstein Ties

#59

Post by moron4hire » Sat, Sep 07, 2019, 8:26 PM UTC

My mother works in the non-profit fundraising sector, originally centered on education, but now runs her own consultancy for non-profits of all sizes. She knows pretty much all the rules and laws about donations and propriety within fundraising foundations. I've helped her with her business, both in actual operations and for her IT concerns. I've also worked in other regulated industries, so I have a fair amount of familiarity with what sort of rules and laws are involved and what the consequences of violating those rules tend to be.

We are livid right now. She has to help a lot of orgs navigate it, where the rules can sometimes be tricky and somewhat counter-intuitive, especially if you don't have accounting experience (and let's face it, most people in fundraising foundations are some of the lowest paid people on campus, and you get what you pay for). Stuff that could get you fined or jail time for what lay-people might consider an honest mistake (but definitely should be considered 101-course material for fundraisers, considering the stakes).

Joichi Ito's actions go way, way beyond that. Who knows just how far the harm he has caused will actually spread. He's harmed the reputation of his institution, his program, and anyone associated with the program. He's lied and cheated for personal gain. It's a no-brainer that he needs to go to jail. Whatever investigation will follow should be focused on finding all the people who knowingly helped him to lock them up alongside him.

Re: Joi Ito Resigns from M.I.T. Media Lab After Outcry over Jeffrey Epstein Ties

#60

Post by khazhou » Sat, Sep 07, 2019, 8:26 PM UTC

liability wrote: post #40

breck wrote: post #14

Those in glass houses... “They were models. Eastern European, definitely,” she told me. Among the lab’s staff, she said, “all of us women made it a point to be super nice to them. We literally had a conversation about how, on the off chance that they’re not there by choice, we could maybe help them.” And what did these people go home and start doing for Eastern European models since then? I find this pretty condescen…

> "I know a few Eastern European models" Do you?

HN users are a varied bunch. There is no reason to not believe him.