What's Deoxyribonucleotide in Sign Language? • Hacker News Board

Re: What's Deoxyribonucleotide in Sign Language?

#51

Post by DavidAdams » Wed, Jul 24, 2019, 7:27 PM UTC

_nalply wrote: post #42

mabbo wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I studied American Sign Language for 3 years in University (more of a drinking club with credits than anything else). We were taught that a lot of signed language is like this- that signs can be invented as needed and agreed upon and that's just a normal part of what makes Signed languages cool. As a result, it was expected that if we traveled a few hundred km in any direction, the local signs might be dramatically d…

Correct.

I'd suppose it's no different than the wide use of local colloquialisms, abbreviations, and pronunciation differences in spoken language region by region. An American in Australia has to intuitively pick up a lot of new vocabulary in order to understand what's going on in addition to the obvious parsing of the accent.

Re: What's Deoxyribonucleotide in Sign Language?

#52

Post by _nalply » Wed, Jul 24, 2019, 7:34 PM UTC

DavidAdams wrote: post #51

_nalply wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Correct.

I'd suppose it's no different than the wide use of local colloquialisms, abbreviations, and pronunciation differences in spoken language region by region. An American in Australia has to intuitively pick up a lot of new vocabulary in order to understand what's going on in addition to the obvious parsing of the accent.

Again: correct.

Re: What's Deoxyribonucleotide in Sign Language?

#53

Post by norgie » Wed, Jul 24, 2019, 7:35 PM UTC

mabbo wrote: post #30

_nalply wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am Deaf myself and my Signed Language (Swiss German Sign Language) is special, so I don't know whether my experience is generalizable. It is very possible to agree upon a language with your interpreters and colleagues who are also Deaf. So you create something not official but what works for you and your situation. This approach often works fine for me: try to convey the meaning into movement and dynamics. Signed L…

I studied American Sign Language for 3 years in University (more of a drinking club with credits than anything else). We were taught that a lot of signed language is like this- that signs can be invented as needed and agreed upon and that's just a normal part of what makes Signed languages cool. As a result, it was expected that if we traveled a few hundred km in any direction, the local signs might be dramatically d…

This is a feature of all natural languages, not just signed ones. We commonly refer to these words or phrase as idioms, slang, jargon, etc.

Re: What's Deoxyribonucleotide in Sign Language?

#54

Post by _nalply » Wed, Jul 24, 2019, 7:39 PM UTC

norgie wrote: post #53

mabbo wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I studied American Sign Language for 3 years in University (more of a drinking club with credits than anything else). We were taught that a lot of signed language is like this- that signs can be invented as needed and agreed upon and that's just a normal part of what makes Signed languages cool. As a result, it was expected that if we traveled a few hundred km in any direction, the local signs might be dramatically d…

This is a feature of all natural languages, not just signed ones. We commonly refer to these words or phrase as idioms, slang, jargon, etc.

Signed Languages are different. It's hard for people who don't talk a Signed Language to understand because of the Blub Paradox.

The word "Blub Paradox" in itself is a good example of what Deaf people do if they encounter concepts they need to communicate. They make up words. Signed Languages are very productive in making up words.

So it is not just an idiom, slang or jargon, it is more than that.

Re: What's Deoxyribonucleotide in Sign Language?

#55

Post by _nalply » Wed, Jul 24, 2019, 7:50 PM UTC

x3n0ph3n3 wrote: post #22

OJFord wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I suppose the equivalent is (what I now know is called) finger spelling: an unnatural 'sounding' word that breaks the flow, but it's [spelling is] taken from a language where it already exists.

See how well spelling out words rather than pronouncing them works for you in conversation. This really is a unique problem to adopting spoken words into a non-vocal language.

Deaf myself: usually we start with fingerspelling. If we discover it being cumbersome we invent something. Borrowing is different but not impossible.

Re: What's Deoxyribonucleotide in Sign Language?

#56

Post by _nalply » Wed, Jul 24, 2019, 7:50 PM UTC

kccqzy wrote: post #24

lozenge wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are there even any text to speech systems available that are accurate for such a highly technical vocabulary?

Yes. The more specialized a field is, the easier it is to tailor the speech recognition system for that.

I am interested. Do you have pointers?

Re: What's Deoxyribonucleotide in Sign Language?

#57

Post by sombremesa » Wed, Jul 24, 2019, 8:54 PM UTC

_nalply wrote: post #29

sombremesa wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why did you capitalize "Deaf"?

Because there is a difference between "deaf" and "Deaf". The capitalized word is meant to highlight the cultural and social parts of living in a community with other Deaf people. You also would not write American in the lower case. Being "deaf" is about the handicap, about the loss of hearing and other problems. Being "Deaf" is about being a member of a community, about the keen visual sense, about communicating in a…

Thanks for your answer. I had an inkling that it was something like that, but didn't know for sure.

Re: What's Deoxyribonucleotide in Sign Language?

#58

Post by vorg » Thu, Jul 25, 2019, 12:03 AM UTC

frenchyatwork wrote: post #48

fao_ wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Both Spanish and English have a fair bit of influence from Latin and from languages that were influenced by Latin. I think you're missing the point. OP claimed that English is the language of science in most other languages. The parent showed, using an example from Spanish, that the actual language of science in most languages is Latin. It is neither here nor there whether or not the language is latin-derived. And…

Ah, I see your point. I suspect that Swahili's "asidi deoxyribonucleic" is probably an English loan-word, but you're right that I don't know, since I haven't done any real research.

Although Mandarin isn't "influenced" by Latin, it is also influenced by English. In China most everyday writing would just insert the letters "DNA" into the text.

But even for scientific writing, my dictionary translates DNA as 脱氧核糖核酸, where 脱 means peel off, 氧 means oxygen, and 核糖核酸 means RNA, so DNA = de-oxy-RNA. As for RNA, 核糖 means ribose and 核酸 means nucleic acid. And in 核酸, 核 means nucleus/core/pip and 酸 means sour/acid, so again the meaning of the characters joined together are simply the sum of their parts. That's always been the case in my limited experience with medical words in Mandarin.

Re: What's Deoxyribonucleotide in Sign Language?

#59

Post by zapzupnz » Thu, Jul 25, 2019, 1:39 AM UTC

_nalply wrote: post #55

x3n0ph3n3 wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

See how well spelling out words rather than pronouncing them works for you in conversation. This really is a unique problem to adopting spoken words into a non-vocal language.

Deaf myself: usually we start with fingerspelling. If we discover it being cumbersome we invent something. Borrowing is different but not impossible.

Not to mention the new signs can involve the hand shapes from, say, the first letter of the borrowed English word. Say the word starts with a D, and everybody recognises the fingerspelt word just from the D alone (in context), then the new sign might use the hand shape for D but give it a specific action.

Re: What's Deoxyribonucleotide in Sign Language?

#60

Post by zapzupnz » Thu, Jul 25, 2019, 1:47 AM UTC

_nalply wrote: post #45

diegoperini wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can I politely ask you to elaborate what keen visual sense means in this context? Is it a sensory experience or something you become good at due to not being able to hear?

Yes, of course. Deaf people use their visual sense instead of hearing. Blind people have a keen hearing, this is something similar. One example: my wife and I realized that we are a lot more able to read the mood of our children by just looking at them than hearing parents. We just "see through" our children.

I believe in linguistic terms this is called operating in a principally visual modality. That is, the majority of your communication is visual in nature, so it becomes second nature.

Even in hearing people, I'm reminded of those who are not just big readers but are used to reading; those who can skim and still obtain 100% of the writer's meaning as opposed to others who aren't so comfortable, fluent, or quick readers — but are not uneducated, just not accustomed to the medium.