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India is sending a rover to the moon, and the country is pumped

nytimes.com

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Re: India is sending a rover to the moon, and the country is pumped

#51

Post by Kaiyou »

sidcool wrote: post #7
tanakachen wrote: post #5

I’ve been to India, and seeing the catastrophic living condition of the majority of its citizens makes me question if going to the moon is the right priority.

There is always one comment like this. But fine. It always is worth. These things inspire the nation. Instill pride. They work wonders. And India's space program is much less expensive than many other nations. India sent a rocket to Mars that was cheaper than the budget for the movie Interstellar.

At the end of the day what is needed is to create wealth, not to spend it. Spending wealth while lots of people in the country are living in poverty in a way, that doesn't directly address this problem may come off as having the wrong priorities. This is about perception.

Re: India is sending a rover to the moon, and the country is pumped

#52

Post by godelski »

lewisjoe wrote: post #36

Folks who suggest dealing with poverty before launching machines to space: the economy doesn't work like that, FYI. If a country acquires deep technical know-how on engineering, it means the country can use it to spin out new industries and export that utility. That is how a country makes money. After world war II, Germany didn't give away all the remaining money to war survivors. They built rock-solid airplane engin…

Tldr: working on any difficult problem causes you to learn things. That knowledge can be used for much more than that original difficult problem.

Re: India is sending a rover to the moon, and the country is pumped

#53

Post by sbmthakur »

DSingularity wrote: post #38
osrec wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do you propose it should do that? By giving people handouts? By giving people terrible jobs in sweatshops? Or perhaps by inspiring the next generation of engineers and innovators? Even those in the slums without any fancy education will be able to relate to the scale and nature of this achievement, if successful. I personally think the expense is worth it.

This is absurd. You should examine the language you are using. You can be a proponent of scientific missions like this without dismissing the very reasonable proposals as “handouts”. They are not. People have a right to a dignified life. No matter how you frame it, the Indian government is ignoring the very real needs of its population when it funds mission like this. No matter how you paint it, the ultra poor couldn…

The Government didn't shut any social program to fund this mission. And before terming it as a nationalistic mission, please go to ISRO's site and educate yourself about the objectives of the mission.

Re: India is sending a rover to the moon, and the country is pumped

#54

Post by Kaiyou »

DSingularity wrote: post #38
osrec wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do you propose it should do that? By giving people handouts? By giving people terrible jobs in sweatshops? Or perhaps by inspiring the next generation of engineers and innovators? Even those in the slums without any fancy education will be able to relate to the scale and nature of this achievement, if successful. I personally think the expense is worth it.

This is absurd. You should examine the language you are using. You can be a proponent of scientific missions like this without dismissing the very reasonable proposals as “handouts”. They are not. People have a right to a dignified life. No matter how you frame it, the Indian government is ignoring the very real needs of its population when it funds mission like this. No matter how you paint it, the ultra poor couldn…

Who is granting people the right to have a dignified life? If there's nobody, they do not, in fact, have that right. Since rights are things that are either given or taken. They do not abstractly "exist".

Re: India is sending a rover to the moon, and the country is pumped

#55

Post by Robotbeat »

hourislate wrote: post #48
Robotbeat wrote: post #8

Awesome. The more the merrier. India will become an economically powerful nation just like China is today. Just a matter of time.

I admire your optimism, but when a country exports it best and brightest talent to build other nations what hope does it ever have. Mediocrity at best?

A good argument for having a space exploration program, then.

Re: India is sending a rover to the moon, and the country is pumped

#56

Post by sbmthakur »

nafey wrote: post #31
aslam2014 wrote: post #18

Well, India first needs to improve its poverty and the living standard of people instead of wasting money.

As a portion of Indian GDP this is miniscule as it is the 6th largest economy in the world. India has lifted around 100 million out of poverty in last ten years.

From 2006 to 2016, India lifted about 271 million people out of poverty[1]. It should be noted that ISRO made considerable progress during this period.

1. https://www.thehindu.com/news/national/india-lifted-271-mill...

Re: India is sending a rover to the moon, and the country is pumped

#57

Post by microtherion »

Redoubts wrote: post #33
saagarjha wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The United States had plenty of homeless people when we went to the moon, perhaps we shouldn’t have?

well, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=goh2x_G0ct4

I was thinking of that song as well. Time to record a Bollywood version?

Re: India is sending a rover to the moon, and the country is pumped

#58

Post by dang »

factorialboy wrote: post #25
aslam2014 wrote: post #18

Well, India first needs to improve its poverty and the living standard of people instead of wasting money.

This is your only contribution to Hacker News in almost 5 years. Telling.

Please don't.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: India is sending a rover to the moon, and the country is pumped

#59

Post by Kaiyou »

marmada wrote: post #50
aslam2014 wrote: post #18

Well, India first needs to improve its poverty and the living standard of people instead of wasting money.

Why will going to the moon make it harder to improve people's standard of living in India? I wasn't aware that it was such a zero-sum game.

It's an effort in spending wealth, instead of creating wealth. Since the country has a problem with poverty, effort should be directed towards creating wealth. It's mostly an issue with perception.

Re: India is sending a rover to the moon, and the country is pumped

#60

Post by Robotbeat »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #49
sct202 wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even if they get stuck at middle income for awhile, that's still like $10k nominal GDP per capita which would put them right around where China is today.

> Even if they get stuck at middle income for awhile That isn’t the downside scenario. Countries that fail to ascend amidst population growth have a habit of collapsing and regressing, economically and politically. India has been doing a terrific job of traversing this terrain, a fact I largely ascribe to its democratic institutions. But continued progress is far from a given. Ironically, one of the greatest risk fac…

Not certain, but it is the most likely possibility. India doesn’t have an oil-dominated economy, so they aren’t in danger of the “resource curse.” Continued catch-up growth seems the most likely possibility. And as others have said, even a “middle income” outcome would make India an incredibly powerful nation due to the size of their population alone.

EDIT: and there’s empirical support for my supposition that not being dependent on primary commodities (ie not having the “resource curse”) improves the odds of escaping the middle income trap: https://ideas.repec.org/p/jet/dpaper/dpaper482.html

“The results of our analyses suggest that the middle-income trap is a form of Dutch disease or a 'resource curse' in the middle-income stage.”

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