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New Swiss studies claim 5G increases body temperature of insects

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Re: New Swiss studies claim 5G increases body temperature of insects

#51

Post by Joakal »

jaabe wrote: post #39
brunoTbear wrote: post #19

What I want to know is who is behind the 5G fear-mongering. I see this all the time and from different places. My poor conspiracy-minded elderly uncle in western Pennsylvania has been had by Fox News and the rest of the insane-right. He sends me stuff like this all the time. What I want to understand is who stands to benefit from 5G not coming to pass. Is it a just one of many conspiracy theories cooked by a Kremlin…

Who benefits from anti-vaccination or flat-earth? Conspiracy theories are probably a lucrative industry if you get enough of a following.

Just like any negative effect; It's influencers who get paid to spread anti-vaccination beliefs even if they don't believe it.

See: far right/left, and other unusual controversial topics.

Re: New Swiss studies claim 5G increases body temperature of insects

#52

Post by adrianN »

freyr wrote: post #28
cadence- wrote: post #4

Interesting. I would like to see more research - especially with humans. That waves used in 4G cause harmful effects on humans was proved to be not true. But those mmWaves for 5G are much higher frequency, and they get absorbed by more materials. Perhaps by human body too? It wouldn’t be healthy to be constantly exposed to waves like that. I definitely would like to see more research in this.

> But those mmWaves for 5G are much higher frequency, and they get absorbed by more materials 4G is on the order of 10^9 Hz (1 GHz), and 5G is on the order of 10^10 - 10^11 Hz. Both are non-ionizing radiation, and in the overall scheme of things, relatively close in frequency. Ionizing radiation causes cell mutation. It starts with UV radiation at 10^16 Hz. X-rays are around 10^18 Hz. We can't say with certainty that…

I'm fairly sure that cell phones are mostly harmless, but the argument that the radiation is not ionizing is a poor one. We know that tissue absorbs some of the radiation, with a fairly strong dependence on the frequency. Biological systems are messy and poorly understood and I find it plausible that slightly wiggling the molecules around disturbs some reaction pathway or other. Given the prevalence of cell phones thoroughly testing this hypothesis is totally warranted imho.

Re: New Swiss studies claim 5G increases body temperature of insects

#53

Post by Google234 »

grecy wrote: post #36
freyr wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But those mmWaves for 5G are much higher frequency, and they get absorbed by more materials 4G is on the order of 10^9 Hz (1 GHz), and 5G is on the order of 10^10 - 10^11 Hz. Both are non-ionizing radiation, and in the overall scheme of things, relatively close in frequency. Ionizing radiation causes cell mutation. It starts with UV radiation at 10^16 Hz. X-rays are around 10^18 Hz. We can't say with certainty that…

You know the World Health Organization lists cell phones as "Possibly Causing Cancer in Humans" right? That's the world's leading authority on human health saying that. I don't care that technically speaking cell phones "can't" cause cancer because they are thought to be non-ionizing. That's just the same as all the other things in history that have been impossible until they've been done.

From your perspective, I suppose everything is possibly carcinogenic since you don't care about whether technically speaking something "can't" cause cancer. I would give more credibility to the numerous scientific studies that have look at this than the words (that could be applied to literally anything) of some working group associated with The WHO. https://www.who.int/en/news-room/fact-sheets/detail/electrom...

Re: New Swiss studies claim 5G increases body temperature of insects

#55

Post by sergiotapia »

jazzyjackson wrote: post #48
sergiotapia wrote: post #41

Birds have started chirping like hell at 3am -- never seen that happen before ever. Who knows how the hell all this radiowave, wifi, and now 5g is raping nature. How can we allow this to happen?

I often walk home around 3 or 4am and I've noticed birds start chirping around this time since about 10 years ago, what timescale are you giving me? I always thought it was the streetlights, but now I live in a less well lit neighborhood and still hear the early risers about 3:30am. This would be a pretty cool dataset to look at ... I wonder if anyone living in a radio quiet zone could give us a data point !

13 year timescale.

Re: New Swiss studies claim 5G increases body temperature of insects

#56

Post by jonhendry18 »

saagarjha wrote: post #20
devoply wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not boy who cried wolf, people just love their mobile internet and corporations and governments love their profit to care about the science: https://www.nih.gov/news-events/news-releases/high-exposure-...

Somewhat important to point out, I think: > “The exposures used in the studies cannot be compared directly to the exposure that humans experience when using a cell phone,” said John Bucher, Ph.D., NTP senior scientist. “In our studies, rats and mice received radio frequency radiation across their whole bodies. By contrast, people are mostly exposed in specific local tissues close to where they hold the phone. In addi…

" By contrast, people are mostly exposed in specific local tissues close to where they hold the phone"

Along with the rest of their body.

Re: New Swiss studies claim 5G increases body temperature of insects

#57

Post by jonhendry18 »

freyr wrote: post #28
cadence- wrote: post #4

Interesting. I would like to see more research - especially with humans. That waves used in 4G cause harmful effects on humans was proved to be not true. But those mmWaves for 5G are much higher frequency, and they get absorbed by more materials. Perhaps by human body too? It wouldn’t be healthy to be constantly exposed to waves like that. I definitely would like to see more research in this.

> But those mmWaves for 5G are much higher frequency, and they get absorbed by more materials 4G is on the order of 10^9 Hz (1 GHz), and 5G is on the order of 10^10 - 10^11 Hz. Both are non-ionizing radiation, and in the overall scheme of things, relatively close in frequency. Ionizing radiation causes cell mutation. It starts with UV radiation at 10^16 Hz. X-rays are around 10^18 Hz. We can't say with certainty that…

The question is, can they have negative effects on insects. Given that under the right conditions a microwave oven can create plasma in a grape, it seems like something to look into before we fry insects, populations of which have already declined significantly.

https://e360.yale.edu/features/insect_numbers_declining_why_...

Re: New Swiss studies claim 5G increases body temperature of insects

#58

Post by jonhendry18 »

balp wrote: post #25
cadence- wrote: post #4

Interesting. I would like to see more research - especially with humans. That waves used in 4G cause harmful effects on humans was proved to be not true. But those mmWaves for 5G are much higher frequency, and they get absorbed by more materials. Perhaps by human body too? It wouldn’t be healthy to be constantly exposed to waves like that. I definitely would like to see more research in this.

Most, almost all animals are mostly water. About 2GHz you have a frequency that resonates with water, it's gets stopped by water, including rain. E.g. it's energy goes into the water, this is how the microwave operates. For this reason it's traditionally considers useless as radio transmission. And turned into a global free frequency span. Making this radio space used by all kinds of devices that you have at home. Wi…

Seems like microwave energy going into water could be a problem if the water is in a gnat or moth or butterfly.

Re: New Swiss studies claim 5G increases body temperature of insects

#59

Post by jonhendry18 »

davesque wrote: post #31

It seems odd to me that there are so many anti-5G stories. It almost comes off as deliberate and targeted. I would imagine that the science of what levels and frequencies of EM radiation are safe is settled.

I really doubt that much effort has been spent on determining the effect of constant, pervasive mm-wave signals on insects.

Re: New Swiss studies claim 5G increases body temperature of insects

#60

Post by freyr »

adrianN wrote: post #52
freyr wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But those mmWaves for 5G are much higher frequency, and they get absorbed by more materials 4G is on the order of 10^9 Hz (1 GHz), and 5G is on the order of 10^10 - 10^11 Hz. Both are non-ionizing radiation, and in the overall scheme of things, relatively close in frequency. Ionizing radiation causes cell mutation. It starts with UV radiation at 10^16 Hz. X-rays are around 10^18 Hz. We can't say with certainty that…

I'm fairly sure that cell phones are mostly harmless, but the argument that the radiation is not ionizing is a poor one. We know that tissue absorbs some of the radiation, with a fairly strong dependence on the frequency. Biological systems are messy and poorly understood and I find it plausible that slightly wiggling the molecules around disturbs some reaction pathway or other. Given the prevalence of cell phones th…

Cellular radiation is tested very thoroughly. So far, the only observed effect is a slight thermal effect at very high received power, as we'd expect.

We can't prove it's completely safe, but nobody yet has been able to demonstrate any compelling evidence that it's unsafe.

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