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$500k a Year yet Struggling? Let's Do a Double Take

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Re: $500k a Year yet Struggling? Let's Do a Double Take

#51
post #41
post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Private school for two kids could be that much in NYC.

If its private school tuition then it should have been under the line item of "private school tuition," not "other expenses."

I don't know about that family, but if I was making 500k my kids would probably be going to a private school.

Re: $500k a Year yet Struggling? Let's Do a Double Take

#52
post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you have used debt to buy a deprecating asset (car or almost anything you can buy with credit card, like iphone) you are not saving. In a long run, your asset will cost 0, and you haven't saved a penny.

I thought they were referring to principal payments on a house mortgage.

House mortgage wasn't what I was referring to specifically. I meant more the paying down student loan debt.

Re: $500k a Year yet Struggling? Let's Do a Double Take

#53

I'll share something I learned myself in another Hacker News comment. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Millionaire_Next_Door "Their findings, that millionaires are disproportionately clustered in middle-class and blue collar neighborhoods and not in more affluent or white-collar communities, came as a surprise to the authors who anticipated the contrary." It really opened my eyes to the fact that most people I think…

Most people's idea of "Rich" is that you have a very high burn rate. Sort of fits with the "Work hard / Play hard" ethos of success in America.

Financial freedom comes from minimizing your burn rate. Far less flashy, but you can stretch money amazingly far when you aren't trying to keep up with what you think people expect of you.

Re: $500k a Year yet Struggling? Let's Do a Double Take

#54
post #15

103,500/year on unexplained "other expenses??" Over $8,500/month?!! Which is almost double their mortgage payments Um.... What the hell? Their biggest line item is completely unexplained yet they are trying to explain where their money goes? I live a fairly indulgent life and I spend less than that on everything in a year. I can't imagine spending six figures on "misc" unless there's a lot of hookers and blow involve…

That's probably utilities, cell phone, tv, after school/nanny/sports/etc for kids activities, Starbucks, food, etc. Not that it isn't a lot but I don't see any other line items for all the stuff and it can add up depending on how you live.

Re: $500k a Year yet Struggling? Let's Do a Double Take

#55
post #32
post #18

Try raising a few kids in a major city and paying private school tuition and child care fees. It easily eats up most of $500K of income.

Hi! My wife & I are raising 2 children in Berlin (a major world city) & earn a lot less than $500k while not struggling at all (in fact I save about 1/3 of my net pay even after deductions for both private and public retirement funds). Sending your kids to private schools is hardly a must, especially if you live in at least a middle-class neighborhood (which I assume you do on a $500k income).

The way the United States provides schooling free of charge from age 4 to age 18, and expects families to pay massive tuition bills before and after, does make parenting expensive at times— especially for young families starting out.

$500,000 in income is, of course, enough money to pay even expensive bills, being well into the top 1% of family incomes.

Re: $500k a Year yet Struggling? Let's Do a Double Take

#56

"Some of these payments are applied to the principal on their loans, which increases the couple’s net worth by either building their home equity or by reducing their student debt. So that’s also savings." I don't count paying down a debt as "savings". It might be an increase in net worth but not savings. If paying down debt is considered "savings" now, then the entire USA is "saving money". But I think that not only…

It sounds like you missed the key point "some of that money is going to principal".

Let's say you bought a house for $100K and for this argument it can always sell for $100K. And you have a 30 year fixed mortgage on it (debt for 30 years). After paying on that debt for 10 years, the principal remaining on the loan is down by about 20%. Now if you sell the house for $100K, you get back in cash $20K.

See how that works? You "saved" $20K over 10 years by making mortgage payments.

It is a little trickier with student loans because really what it means as you pay down your student loans is that you "owe less". Conceptually, if you decided to zero out your accounts, pay all your debts, sell all your assets. Then the amount of money left over would be "more" if you had spent 10 years paying down your student debt than if you had not. That difference is calculable and adds to your "net worth" (your cash value after zeroing everything out).

Re: $500k a Year yet Struggling? Let's Do a Double Take

#57

"Some of these payments are applied to the principal on their loans, which increases the couple’s net worth by either building their home equity or by reducing their student debt. So that’s also savings." I don't count paying down a debt as "savings". It might be an increase in net worth but not savings. If paying down debt is considered "savings" now, then the entire USA is "saving money". But I think that not only…

All debt isn't the same. I see it as savings when the debt is backed by an asset like a a mortgage is, then paying it down gives you more equity in the asset. If you sell the home, this equity converts into cash. You could also get another low interest loan with the equity. It's just as much savings as a 401k which can go up or down but generally up in value over long periods of time. Paying off another type of debt like student loan debt doesn't have the same benefits.

Re: $500k a Year yet Struggling? Let's Do a Double Take

#58
post #15

103,500/year on unexplained "other expenses??" Over $8,500/month?!! Which is almost double their mortgage payments Um.... What the hell? Their biggest line item is completely unexplained yet they are trying to explain where their money goes? I live a fairly indulgent life and I spend less than that on everything in a year. I can't imagine spending six figures on "misc" unless there's a lot of hookers and blow involve…

Eating all organic, fresh-from-farm food, eating at luxury restaurants, attending internationally acclaimed shows in the best seating, and maybe even investing in a little bit of modern art? Oh, and purchasing all the best in skincare, makup, spas, saunas, cryotherapy, light therapy, etc? Personal trainers, coaches, cleaners, cooks? I could imagine a combination of all of those could be 8,500$ a month. (EDIT: And I b…

Unless you’re feeding a small army, it’s not possible for groceries alone to add up to anything like that. Eating out easily could ($200/day x 30 days = $6000!) but not from actual cooking.

Re: $500k a Year yet Struggling? Let's Do a Double Take

#59
post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you have used debt to buy a deprecating asset (car or almost anything you can buy with credit card, like iphone) you are not saving. In a long run, your asset will cost 0, and you haven't saved a penny.

I thought they were referring to principal payments on a house mortgage.

Even in this case, your house value can take a sudden plunge. Savings are savings, they are not going anywhere. It's money that sits in your bank account and you always know how many years without work you can afford.

Re: $500k a Year yet Struggling? Let's Do a Double Take

#60
I love how this old TV commercial pretty much sums up the way some people live:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PV_YAeXOSiw

People who think it's OK to spend every dime that comes in. They've bought into the recent concept that they deserve everything they want and more... then when shit happens... it's a damn hard lesson.

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