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How well do London buses match the timetables?

michalpaszkiewicz.co.uk

51–60 of 60 posts

Re: How well do London buses match the timetables?

#51
I've been in London for five years and don't think I've ever used the printed timetables, the live ones at some bus stops work surprisingly well (and saves me having to whip out my phone to check City Mapper, which started in London).

Something that the article missed is that late buses are compounded. As the delay causes more people to wait, those people getting on delay the bus even further, that's where the adage "wait ages for a bus, then two come at once" stems from. Even if the bus behind it is also delayed, it makes up time as the previous bus has scoped up all passengers. Occationally buses will divert/ terminate to rebalance the timetable.

I was recently in hospital, where the wifi wasn't great so I spent a lot of time looking out the window, and onto a busy junction. During the later part of rush hour buses often arrived together, even saw three of the same bus arrived together (only a couple vehicles separating the last bus) at one point! (like I said, bad wifi) It was staggering seeing so many ambulances arrive during the weekend, they often arrive together as the first ambulance clears a path (like in Die Hard 3).

You also see that on the tube, when people are fighting to get on a train (delaying it further) then the one following a couple of minutes behind is largely empty, it's even a little more pronounced as trains can't leapfrog each other to spread the load.

Re: How well do London buses match the timetables?

#52
post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In Europe theres regulations over labelling etc. In the UK if you buy a 'pint' of milk it will still be labelled 0.568 litres. Presumably there are some rules in the US also, or labels could just use some obscure measures that hide what a product contains.

Yes, there are definitely rules. Virtually every product on store shelves in the US seems to be labeled with metric or imperial units depending on what is more convenient or less obscure to the public, though sizes for many products are the same across the oceans which can make for weird numbers for everyone. Labeling definitely isn't always imperial in the US, and it isn't always metric in many European countries. R…

>which in the US is labeled as "0.5L"/"500mL" usually along

I hope that you mean it's labeled as 0.5L or 500mL and not both of them with a slash.

Re: How well do London buses match the timetables?

#53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, there are definitely rules. Virtually every product on store shelves in the US seems to be labeled with metric or imperial units depending on what is more convenient or less obscure to the public, though sizes for many products are the same across the oceans which can make for weird numbers for everyone. Labeling definitely isn't always imperial in the US, and it isn't always metric in many European countries. R…

>which in the US is labeled as "0.5L"/"500mL" usually along I hope that you mean it's labeled as 0.5L or 500mL and not both of them with a slash.

Yes, exactly. I was hoping my quotes helped clarify that but I can see how it's unclear...

Re: How well do London buses match the timetables?

#54
post #6

On trains and planes, my main critieria is that I arrive by the stated arrival time and therefore am pretty unfussed by stories about padding time etc - that's more of a long term structural concern than something that will bother me on the day. I think operators have figured this is all most people really care about over time (perhaps excepting highly competitive routes.) You lose this ability to check timings with…

Right - the arrival time is a no-later-than and that’s all I need. People complain about leaving a gate in an aeroplane and then sitting on the apron for a bit - who cares if you’re on the ground or in the air or even going backwards - I just care about my arrival time and don’t mind what you do as long as you hit that. I use a flight that’s regularly delayed by half an hour but still gets there half an hour early. W…

It depends a bit on where I'm sitting. If I'm in first class (most of the time I am these days) I don't really mind, but if I'm in steerage with my knees pressed up against the seat in front of me I want to spend the absolute minimum amount of time possible physically onboard the plane.

Likewise I don't mind wasting time in an airport when I have a company per diem to pay for my drinks, but if it's on my own dime I'd rather not spend any longer than necessary sitting around in uncomfortable airport seats.

Re: How well do London buses match the timetables?

#55
Wow, that certainly took a sharp turn into melodrama at the end.

What happened to truth is that there wasn't much clarity to begin with and then the schedulers found out that they could meet expectations by using that ambiguity. Mystery: solved!

Now lets see if they complain about current and electrons going in opposite directions...

Re: How well do London buses match the timetables?

#56

I wonder whether this is the norm for other cities?

In Stockholm there is a per station schedule and the busses try to match it, generally being pretty good about it in the suburbs, so you can reliably get to the stop with below a minute to spare and catch the buss.

In the backwater I live in now, the situation is situation is supposedly the same, but the busses are much worse about matching the timetable. Be there 3 minutes before the timetable or watch the buss leave ahead of schedule to then spend those minutes waiting at the tow centre before getting under way again.

Re: How well do London buses match the timetables?

#57
post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right - the arrival time is a no-later-than and that’s all I need. People complain about leaving a gate in an aeroplane and then sitting on the apron for a bit - who cares if you’re on the ground or in the air or even going backwards - I just care about my arrival time and don’t mind what you do as long as you hit that. I use a flight that’s regularly delayed by half an hour but still gets there half an hour early. W…

I also care about departure time. If I arrive with one minute to spare (counting security and check in) but the plane leaves 2 minutes early I don't get their on time through no fault of my own. If I'm even a second late I accept it is my fault.

Airlines I've flown publish and abide the door-closing time. (For Delta domestic flights, it's 15 minutes before scheduled departure, 30 for int'l. I think they put 20 minutes on domestic boarding passes as a buffer against watch skew arguments.)

I've seen the gate agents paying scrupulous attention to that, to ensure they don't close the gate early if any pax who have checked in haven't boarded.

Re: How well do London buses match the timetables?

#58
post #22
post #6

On trains and planes, my main critieria is that I arrive by the stated arrival time and therefore am pretty unfussed by stories about padding time etc - that's more of a long term structural concern than something that will bother me on the day. I think operators have figured this is all most people really care about over time (perhaps excepting highly competitive routes.) You lose this ability to check timings with…

In Europe, train operators often have a target percentage, like 90%, of trains that must be on time[0] specified in their concession, with a system of fines or bonuses. So they have an incentive to put some padding in their schedules, since that will improve their lateness statistics. [0] Usually defined as being less than 5 minutes late or so.

Good - so it keeps them honest. Are you suggesting they should be forced to publish timetables which they know will be wrong 10% of the time?

Re: How well do London buses match the timetables?

#59
post #58
post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In Europe, train operators often have a target percentage, like 90%, of trains that must be on time[0] specified in their concession, with a system of fines or bonuses. So they have an incentive to put some padding in their schedules, since that will improve their lateness statistics. [0] Usually defined as being less than 5 minutes late or so.

Good - so it keeps them honest. Are you suggesting they should be forced to publish timetables which they know will be wrong 10% of the time?

I'd like them to ride a bit faster if they can, actually, yes. They play it way too safe at the moment.

Re: How well do London buses match the timetables?

#60

I wonder whether this is the norm for other cities?

In Stockholm there is a per station schedule and the busses try to match it, generally being pretty good about it in the suburbs, so you can reliably get to the stop with below a minute to spare and catch the buss. In the backwater I live in now, the situation is situation is supposedly the same, but the busses are much worse about matching the timetable. Be there 3 minutes before the timetable or watch the buss leav…

Leaving before the scheduled time should be punished with a double fine, really.
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