Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Many Chinese suffer discrimination based on their regional origin

economist.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

51–60 of 92 posts

Re: Many Chinese suffer discrimination based on their regional origin

#51

Post by Cookingboy »

icsllaf wrote: post #42

For how "homogeneous" China is considered, regions often define people more than ethnicity or racial groups. A common greeting that most people ask is "Where are you from?" Both migrant workers and the growing middle class now have the ability to travel anywhere in the country to further their futures. Back in the 70s or even the 90s this mixing of people was pretty much unheard of. Shanghai culture was only in Shang…

>would make the differences between Americans look miniscule.

The culture, custom and language difference is definitely more drastic than it is in the U.S. I was somewhat bullied as a young kid in Shanghai because I couldn't speak Shanghainese that well.

However value is mostly not as divisive as it is here. I'm talking about the same kind of success is valued and worshipped throughout the country, urban and countryside alike. People also largely share similar family value, similar world view, and even similar opinions of domestic and foreign politics. In the U.S. I get the impression that everyone wants the best for the country, but they just drastically disagree on what an "ideal America" should look like. It's looking more and more like one side's paradise is the other side's nightmare.

Personally I theorize a lot of that is due to decades of centralized media, propaganda and a top down, heavily scrutinized education system, but in this case one can't help but wonder if democracy is always better judging by the extreme polarization of media bubble and social value in American society. In fact, we reached the level that democracy is only tolerated in the U.S. but not liked by most people. If you give a theoretical ballot/proposition to Hilary voters that strip Trump voters of voting rights and vice versa, I have a feeling a significant amount of voters across both sides will vote YES, but not admit in doing so.

But that's discussion for a different day.

Re: Many Chinese suffer discrimination based on their regional origin

#52

Post by fxbl0i »

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #45
fxbl0i wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not whataboutism, I'm saying that this is perfectly normal and therefore I don't think it's valid criticism of China in particular.

That is exactly what a what aboutism is.

No, I'm not saying before we can criticise China we have to fix the rest of the world. Tribalism is normal and healthy, and there's nothing to fix.

Re: Many Chinese suffer discrimination based on their regional origin

#53

Post by jldugger »

joshypants wrote: post #36
jldugger wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Was that mentioned in the article? I'm not an economist subscriber so I only read the free blurb.

There's been a lot of reporting on this really dangerous situation, here's a recent article: https://www.theguardian.com/news/2019/apr/11/china-hi-tech-w...

I'm aware of the situation regarding the Uighurs, I'm asking if you're bringing this up out of the blue or if it's directly related to the article neither of us have read.

Re: Many Chinese suffer discrimination based on their regional origin

#54

Post by manishsharan »

cpufry wrote: post #2

i wonder what kind of discrimination south asians face as well. considering vast majority of south asians in tech are from certain parts of india.

Nobody hates and discriminates against Indians more than other Indians! ;-)

Re: Many Chinese suffer discrimination based on their regional origin

#55

Post by Faramir4k »

bilbo0s wrote: post #46
linuxftw wrote: post #16

You should hear what people say about people that were born and raised in the US South. Seems in some places, it's perfectly (socially) acceptable to pick on others, as long as you're picking on the 'right' group of folks.

> Seems in some places, it's perfectly (socially) acceptable to pick on others, as long as you're picking on the 'right' group of folks... This is the US. Here, it's perfectly acceptable to pick on everyone . From blacks, and handicapped people, to bankers, and frat boys. You can discriminate against whoever you like here. At least in the jokes and social situations. You should hear what they say about blacks, or gre…

>From blacks (big no), and handicapped people (big no), to bankers (yes w/ no racial connotations), and frat boys (yes)

Re: Many Chinese suffer discrimination based on their regional origin

#56

Post by zarkov99 »

bilbo0s wrote: post #50
zarkov99 wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unless you care about your job, your career, your reputation, your personal safety and that of your loved ones. In that case you should make sure you only target approved groups.

There are no "approved grouups". What are you talking about? Are you saying you never hear people talk bad about bankers, or frat boys, or jews, or cops, or blacks, or hispanics, etc etc etc? Because if so, I call BS. I also call BS if you try to tell me that everyone you've heard talk bad about, say, bankers or jews, has been fired from their job. Sure, you go up to your boss and tell your jokes about money grubbing…

I envy your perspective. What I see in the news, in academia, in the movie industry, in hiring, basically in the public culture, is very different. This has changed dramatically in the last say 5 years, and I am having trouble understanding how you can argue that in 2019 we can still all make fun of each other freely.

Re: Many Chinese suffer discrimination based on their regional origin

#57

Post by bilbo0s »

Faramir4k wrote: post #55
bilbo0s wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Seems in some places, it's perfectly (socially) acceptable to pick on others, as long as you're picking on the 'right' group of folks... This is the US. Here, it's perfectly acceptable to pick on everyone . From blacks, and handicapped people, to bankers, and frat boys. You can discriminate against whoever you like here. At least in the jokes and social situations. You should hear what they say about blacks, or gre…

>From blacks (big no), and handicapped people (big no), to bankers (yes w/ no racial connotations), and frat boys (yes)

BS.

I'm in middle of nowhere Wisconsin, and I hear jokes about blacks and handicapped people all the time. When I lived in Houston, it was the same. (Well, mostly about blacks. But still.)

If you're telling me you don't, I'm telling you that you're talking out of your posterior orifice.

Re: Many Chinese suffer discrimination based on their regional origin

#58

Post by yorwba »

Cookingboy wrote: post #51
icsllaf wrote: post #42

For how "homogeneous" China is considered, regions often define people more than ethnicity or racial groups. A common greeting that most people ask is "Where are you from?" Both migrant workers and the growing middle class now have the ability to travel anywhere in the country to further their futures. Back in the 70s or even the 90s this mixing of people was pretty much unheard of. Shanghai culture was only in Shang…

>would make the differences between Americans look miniscule. The culture, custom and language difference is definitely more drastic than it is in the U.S. I was somewhat bullied as a young kid in Shanghai because I couldn't speak Shanghainese that well. However value is mostly not as divisive as it is here. I'm talking about the same kind of success is valued and worshipped throughout the country, urban and countrys…

> I was somewhat bullied as a young kid in Shanghai because I couldn't speak Shanghainese that well.

Do you think the importance of Shanghainese has changed since then? When I was there, the only people I heard speak Shanghainese looked to be 40 or older, younger people seemed to exclusively use Mandarin.

Re: Many Chinese suffer discrimination based on their regional origin

#59

Post by stcredzero »

SolaceQuantum wrote: post #49
stcredzero wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seems in some places, it's perfectly (socially) acceptable to pick on others, as long as you're picking on the 'right' group of folks. There has been widespread advocacy for this sort of socially acceptable "picking on" in the West and in the United States in recent years. People in the SV/Bay Area tech and creative circles will do this. A few years ago, media people were advocating that we label people "Nazis" and t…

Not meaning to disagree but I want to know what are your suggestions regarding how to combat extremist viewpoints that seriously advocate for genocide (what I assume would get one labeled a nazi). Do you have evidence of nonviolent alternatives that work? (Again: I'm not saying that violence is the only answer- I genuinely am seeking evidence otherwise as I abhor violence.)

your suggestions regarding how to combat extremist viewpoints that seriously advocate for genocide

Those are pretty simple to advocate against. Murder bad. Who disagrees with that? Basically no one. Genocide bad. Who disagrees with that? Basically no one.

However, here's how you can actually strengthen the bad side. Start pushing ridiculous narratives. Start calling everyone a Nazi. Say that even the "Ok" sign is a Nazi salute. Advocate for political violence. Basically, abandon the principles and moral framework of liberal democracy, and become just like them.

The best way to combat extremist viewpoints is through adherence to principles and a moral framework -- showing that these can make you prosper. This is basically how we won the cold war.

(what I assume would get one labeled a nazi)

Bad assumption in 2019. In 2019, there are toxic members of the Far Left who will label anyone that for any kind of dissent from their particular views.

I genuinely am seeking evidence otherwise as I abhor violence.

If you are in the United States, then the evidence is all around you. It must be understood in the context of world history, however. If you truly abhor violence, then if you are a member of the left, you need to start calling it out on the left. The best way to fight evil, is to be forthright and speak out about it.

Re: Many Chinese suffer discrimination based on their regional origin

#60

Post by loudmax »

linuxftw wrote: post #16

You should hear what people say about people that were born and raised in the US South. Seems in some places, it's perfectly (socially) acceptable to pick on others, as long as you're picking on the 'right' group of folks.

You should hear what people say about people that were born and raised outside the US.

Seems in some places, it's perfectly (legally) acceptable to pick on others, as long as you're picking on the 'wrong' group of folks.

Post reply on HN