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Ask HN: Those who moved careers from the West to China, what's your experience?

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Re: Ask HN: Those who moved careers from the West to China, what's your experience?

#51
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[deleted]

I don't think you're going to get away from this. By living in and working in China, paying Chinese taxes, and supporting Chinese companies, you are directly supporting an authoritarian regeime.

As a Canadian living in and working in America, I have a similar although less dramatic moral difficulty. The fact is that the American government is curiously abusive compared to your average developed national government.

Re: Ask HN: Those who moved careers from the West to China, what's your experience?

#52

Why would anyone willingly move to an authoritarian dictatorship?

There is a million Taiwanese living in China, most of them go there to work or have families in China. Mainland China tends to have higher wages, lower living costs, better working conditions and a lot of young Taiwanese talent move to the Mainland which is cited as a brain drain problem in Taiwan.

Sources: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overseas_Taiwanese

https://www.google.com/amp/amp.timeinc.net/time/4906162/taiw...

Re: Ask HN: Those who moved careers from the West to China, what's your experience?

#53
post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think you're going to get away from this. By living in and working in China, paying Chinese taxes, and supporting Chinese companies, you are directly supporting an authoritarian regeime.

As a Canadian living in and working in America, I have a similar although less dramatic moral difficulty. The fact is that the American government is curiously abusive compared to your average developed national government.

As an American citizen I agree with you, but I think that the comparison to China is excessive and inappropriate - and serves as some kind of perverted justification for China's crimes against humanity.

Re: Ask HN: Those who moved careers from the West to China, what's your experience?

#54
post #5

To be honest, don’t don’t it. Unless you’re of Chinese descent and speak the language, you won’t be able to advance in most companies. The work culture is alien to most westerners and the benefits to your career are negligible. Mostly depends on what you want out of your career but speaking as someone that lived in China and worked in Chinese tech companies for seven years, including being the first foreign hire for…

"Unless you’re of Chinese descent and speak the language, you won’t be able to advance in most companies." There is no such issue when working for international or western companies and/or startups. Also a local mobile games company is not a good example to generalize with since games industry is known for being pretty horrible here. Internationally as well. While there are some things many westeners might find annoy…

I guess language barrier is the main issue here? In western companies, it's also hard to advance to high/exec levels if someone cannot communicate in English well.

Re: Ask HN: Those who moved careers from the West to China, what's your experience?

#55
post #45

I’ve sort of done the move. If you are not ethnically Chinese and speak the language, there will be a few things to get used to. The degree will depend a bit on where you end up. For example: - pollution can be a big problem. - if Chinese company, work culture can be very different. More top down, longer hours etc. - noisy. Most places you go in big cities you are surrounded by noise. Cars, people, construction. It d…

I would like to add: Even if you are ethnically Chinese and speak the language, don't go back to China unless you really cannot find a decent job in the west.

Especially if you are young and educated in the west, here are the things to consider:

- It is not very hard to find a STEM job in the west, and the pay is good.

- Your parents are healthy now, not much to worry. It's better to get a green card before they get old.

- You may start a family soon. It is much much easier to raise a child in the west.

Re: Ask HN: Those who moved careers from the West to China, what's your experience?

#56
post #31

i've been in Hong Kong for 6.5 years already. Worked in small consultancies, large logistics company, and local startup. PROS: a) Salary is high, especially if you get to work in finance/insurance/luxury retail fields b) disposable income (aka savings) is extremely high as income tax is low, no more than 17%, also, no capital gains tax! c) great hub to work and explore Asia CONS: a) IT jobs (development mainly) aren'…

That's a great point about access to Shenzhen from HK. How's the language barrier been? Have you had to learn both Canto and Mando and read both simplified and traditional? Is there a distinct advantage to living on one side of the border over the other?

The hard part living in HK for a lot of people is real estate price. It's extremely expensive either to rent or buy apartments. Lot of people live in apartments less than 200 sqr feet, and the average living space per person is less than 100 sqr feet.

Moreover, Shenzhen is one of China's tech capitals while HK is mostly finance.

Re: Ask HN: Those who moved careers from the West to China, what's your experience?

#57

Why would anyone willingly move to an authoritarian dictatorship?

For me it was the money and opportunities. I turned a blind eye to the power abuse, human rights violations and corruption, and moved to the US anyways.

"I turned a blind eye to the power abuse, human rights violations and corruption"

I'm not sure how you can compare the US, which does have it's problems, but is one of the least racist (and offers many more opportunities to people that start with nothing) countries in the world to China, one of the most corrupt and authoritarian.

In China, for example, you need to include your head shot on your resume and I've known people that were told the were too fat to work at a company.

If people actually cared, they would look at the gross human rights abuses by the Chinese government.

You just don't see things like this:

https://www.hrw.org/world-report/2018/country-chapters/china...

In the US.

Re: Ask HN: Those who moved careers from the West to China, what's your experience?

#58
post #18
post #5

To be honest, don’t don’t it. Unless you’re of Chinese descent and speak the language, you won’t be able to advance in most companies. The work culture is alien to most westerners and the benefits to your career are negligible. Mostly depends on what you want out of your career but speaking as someone that lived in China and worked in Chinese tech companies for seven years, including being the first foreign hire for…

Thanks for the insights, much appreciated! To be clear, are you a westerner who made this move, or a Chinese native? If the former, how did the startup culture compare to the US startup culture? >of Chinese descent and speak the language What about westerns who speak mando? Is it workable or still too much of a culture shock? Is racism abundant?

>mando

Is it a regional norm around you to refer to Mandarin as "Mando?" Never heard of this in my life...

Re: Ask HN: Those who moved careers from the West to China, what's your experience?

#59

I've been considering a move to Japan. My pay would likely be several tens of thousands of dollars less (still very good, relative to the market but less than what I could command in a Western market), but it's also an opportunity to have a very different life experience. Money vs. experience, it's really tough for me to figure out what's more important.

If you're relatively young, no kids, etc. then it's definitely worth trying out for a couple of years. You won't have lost much time.

Re: Ask HN: Those who moved careers from the West to China, what's your experience?

#60

I've been considering a move to Japan. My pay would likely be several tens of thousands of dollars less (still very good, relative to the market but less than what I could command in a Western market), but it's also an opportunity to have a very different life experience. Money vs. experience, it's really tough for me to figure out what's more important.

One anecdote - I moved to Japan 12 years ago when I was 26 to work as an engineer in a game company. I stayed for two years. Like anywhere there were pros and cons but overall it was a fantastic life experience that I’m very glad I did.
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