Weekend ‘catch-up sleep’ is a lie • Hacker News Board

Re: Weekend ‘catch-up sleep’ is a lie

#51

Post by raverbashing » Wed, Mar 06, 2019, 9:33 AM UTC

freddie_mercury wrote: post #13

dasanman wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But if it "feels that way", doesnt that have something to say as well?

In the absence of any actual evidence? Generally we take self-reported feelings as not especially strong evidence. Maybe all it says is they grew up thinking that "weekend sleeping helped catch-up" and now they only remember the confirming evidence and discard the disconfirming evidence to support their confirmation bias?

Except a lot of studies and protocols do rely on self-assessment of conditions.

Pain scores, Depression scores are the ones I remember right now

So yes, it is something that's used because you don't have a way of directly measuring all things

Re: Weekend ‘catch-up sleep’ is a lie

#52

Post by strken » Wed, Mar 06, 2019, 9:39 AM UTC

bgentry wrote: post #9

ferros wrote: post #8

I can’t speak for scientific analysis, but I can say that if I have had a disrupted week of sleep, a weekend catch up ‘resets’ me and serves its intended purpose (for me)

While it may feel this way, the science strongly indicates this is not the case. The study in the linked article is one proof point. Many others are summarized in Matthew Walker’s “Why We Sleep”.

The "science" in the linked WaPo article, and the science from the journal, weakly indicate that if you get 5 hours of sleep each night for an entire work week you will get fat, and sleeping in for an extra hour on the weekend won't stop you getting even more fat when you do the same thing on Monday and Tuesday.

This has almost nothing to do with what ferros said. No, resting on the weekend won't uneat or burn the extra calories, in the same way that it won't rewrite all your bad code or help your fuzzy memory, but it could very well help you perform at a more normal level the next week.

Re: Weekend ‘catch-up sleep’ is a lie

#53

Post by tonyedgecombe » Wed, Mar 06, 2019, 9:54 AM UTC

FooHentai wrote: post #45

xster wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This needs to be top comment. Society's tolerance for bombastic 'journalistic' claims with no consequences is the source of so much of our present issues. Conclusions are cheap.

>is the source of so much of our present issues. Citation needed. Because hyperbole is no different in meta.

>Because hyperbole is no different in meta

Citation need... Oh wait, this is discussion, not an academic paper.

Re: Weekend ‘catch-up sleep’ is a lie

#54

Post by erik_seaberg » Wed, Mar 06, 2019, 9:59 AM UTC

krageon wrote: post #21

dasanman wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But if it "feels that way", doesnt that have something to say as well?

The important thing to keep in mind there is that it doesn't much matter what the science tells you: It makes you feel better and it costs you almost nothing. That makes it a valuable pursuit even if we couldn't find evidence for it working (though another post in this chain mentions some evidence that it does work for a single week).

When sleeping more shortens my waking life, I really want to know how important it is.

Re: Weekend ‘catch-up sleep’ is a lie

#55

Post by CannisterFlux » Wed, Mar 06, 2019, 9:59 AM UTC

strken wrote: post #52

bgentry wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While it may feel this way, the science strongly indicates this is not the case. The study in the linked article is one proof point. Many others are summarized in Matthew Walker’s “Why We Sleep”.

The "science" in the linked WaPo article, and the science from the journal, weakly indicate that if you get 5 hours of sleep each night for an entire work week you will get fat, and sleeping in for an extra hour on the weekend won't stop you getting even more fat when you do the same thing on Monday and Tuesday. This has almost nothing to do with what ferros said. No, resting on the weekend won't uneat or burn the ex…

How does sleeping less make you fat? Eating more will make you fat, eating less will make you less fat. If you sleep less you have more time to eat more, but that still requires the eating to happen.

Re: Weekend ‘catch-up sleep’ is a lie

#56

Post by krageon » Wed, Mar 06, 2019, 10:04 AM UTC

gdfasfklshg4 wrote: post #36

krageon wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, it is not legally compliant. It maybe has lost a little bit of value to actually discuss this as it's been done so, so much. If you are very interested in what is and what is not compliant, you can read the resources published by the EU on the GDPR. They are very legible and relatively easy to understand.

Thank you for answering. I assume you are a subject matter expert qualified to interpret the legal documents? I have actually read some of the resources AND been there whilst customers received advice from lawyers. From what I had understood this model looked dubious. I have not seen a discussion of this that didn't just end up in talking about morals. Even excluding this I really only wanted input from experts - ans…

For various reasons I am and have been deeply embedded inside the process of making a medium-large sized business (if you really look you may be able to figure out which one it is - in case you do: My opinions are my own and do not reflect those of my employer in any way, shape or form) GDPR compliant. I have heard proper lawyers explain the terms to different kinds of people and found their conclusions match my own, coming from the literature. I feel like that allows me to talk a little bit about what this legislation means.

Given what you have said, perhaps the literature is not as obvious as I thought. As far as this model is concerned, it would not be compliant with the law as I read it and as I have had it explained to me. I don't deny that a party with enough money might be able to muscle a reading into existence that allows them to do this anyway, but that is I think an established risk of the legal system. For now we must operate with the law as written and broadly interpreted inside the EU.

Re: Weekend ‘catch-up sleep’ is a lie

#57

Post by mcv » Wed, Mar 06, 2019, 10:04 AM UTC

The primary reason why 'catch-up sleep' is a lie, not mentioned by this article, is that on Saturday 7 am children will start jumping on your bed.

At least that's been my experience.

More seriously, my body seems to have adapted to shorter sleep. I used to read about famous insomniacs like Napoleon who functioned quite well on only 2 hours of sleep per night, but lately my body seems to have become unable to sleep for 8 hours. I often sleep only 5 hours and that seems to work fine for me now.

Re: Weekend ‘catch-up sleep’ is a lie

#58

Post by gpderetta » Wed, Mar 06, 2019, 10:06 AM UTC

mcv wrote: post #57

The primary reason why 'catch-up sleep' is a lie, not mentioned by this article, is that on Saturday 7 am children will start jumping on your bed. At least that's been my experience. More seriously, my body seems to have adapted to shorter sleep. I used to read about famous insomniacs like Napoleon who functioned quite well on only 2 hours of sleep per night, but lately my body seems to have become unable to sleep fo…

The same kids that you have to literally drag out of bed during schooldays!

Re: Weekend ‘catch-up sleep’ is a lie

#59

Post by freddie_mercury » Wed, Mar 06, 2019, 10:07 AM UTC

welly wrote: post #31

freddie_mercury wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To push back some, how do you see your statement as different from post-modernist ("subjectivism is all that matters") or anti-intellectualist ("I don't care what science has to say") arguments in other subjects?

Surely in this example, it doesn't matter what science concludes. If the OP feels better after a weekend of sleep, then simply they feel better? Science can't demand that they're either lying or disillusioned. I say this as someone who has a strong belief in science.

I guess I was more talking about how the default reaction wasn't "hmm, maybe this new science should cause me to reevaluate my priors".

Instead it was to, within seconds/minutes, post about how this new scientific finding doesn't apply to them and they don't need to change any existing beliefs or behavior.

Surely our default reaction should be to deeply question our existing beliefs when disconfirming evidence comes up?

Re: Weekend ‘catch-up sleep’ is a lie

#60

Post by krageon » Wed, Mar 06, 2019, 10:08 AM UTC

erik_seaberg wrote: post #54

krageon wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The important thing to keep in mind there is that it doesn't much matter what the science tells you: It makes you feel better and it costs you almost nothing. That makes it a valuable pursuit even if we couldn't find evidence for it working (though another post in this chain mentions some evidence that it does work for a single week).

When sleeping more shortens my waking life, I really want to know how important it is.

If your waking life feels like shit when you don't sleep an hour more, I don't know what more incentive you need to sleep an hour more (given that you are free to do so).