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Hospitals release lists of retail prices for services

modernhealthcare.com

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Re: Hospitals release lists of retail prices for services

#51

Post by dragonwriter »

nwhatt wrote: post #32
40four wrote: post #31

This is very exciting to me. I have been wanting this for a long time, and I belive it's a small step towards improving the healthcare system in the United States. It shouldn't matter these aren't he "real" prices, as so many folks have been quick to point out. But it's the starting point for what ever you think the "real" price is, and it's information that has never been easily accessible to the public until now. A…

Well said. In the Health IT community many have been quick to dismiss it as useless data, but data is data.

> but data is data.

No, data that doesn't have any coherent practical meaning is worse than no data (well, it's worth exactly the same as no data if and only if you recognize the fact that it has no coherent practical meaning and disregard it entirely.)

One of the classic bad-management failures is finding some easy to quantify it irrelevant to purpose number and optimizing around it because, hey, it may not be perfect “but data is data”.

Re: Hospitals release lists of retail prices for services

#52

Post by TylerE »

zeroname wrote: post #50
abalone wrote: post #39

> Modern Healthcare decided to see how long it would take to present the data in a more consumer-friendly format. It took less than two hours Having been through several hundred thousand dollars of chargemaster charges with one of the hospitals on this list I can confidently say this info is not consumer-friendly at all. First of all, did anyone look at the damn PDFs? Do you have any idea what a "HCHG SP EVAL MTN FLU…

Medicare for all would easily bankrupt hospitals. The money needs to come from somewhere. Either force people to buy insurance or raise taxes massively. Pick your poison.

Firing all of those billing specialists and insurance people would save a LOT of money.

Re: Hospitals release lists of retail prices for services

#53

Post by abalone »

zeroname wrote: post #50
abalone wrote: post #39

> Modern Healthcare decided to see how long it would take to present the data in a more consumer-friendly format. It took less than two hours Having been through several hundred thousand dollars of chargemaster charges with one of the hospitals on this list I can confidently say this info is not consumer-friendly at all. First of all, did anyone look at the damn PDFs? Do you have any idea what a "HCHG SP EVAL MTN FLU…

Medicare for all would easily bankrupt hospitals. The money needs to come from somewhere. Either force people to buy insurance or raise taxes massively. Pick your poison.

Literally every other industrialized country has a Medicare For All type system and somehow the hospitals manage to stay open.

And you can’t mention a tax increase without mentioning the savings of not having to pay for private insurance.

Re: Hospitals release lists of retail prices for services

#54

Post by dragonwriter »

all_blue_chucks wrote: post #13
nonbel wrote: post #11

Those are not the real prices. Those are "chargemaster" prices, they are pretty much entirely irrelevant. The true price is usually going to be somewhere between 10-50% of the chargemaster: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chargemaster http://selfpaypatient.com/2014/01/03/insured-patients-can-sa...

Nonsense. These are the prices they charge people who lack insurance. They're very real if you get a bill with them on it.

> These are the prices they charge people who lack insurance.

No, they are the fake numbers they keep around as starting points so that (1) insurance can claim to have negotiated price down, and (2) they can claim the inflated numbers to be the “usual and customary charge to the general public” for purposes of government programs like Medicaid which include the usual and customary charge to the general public as one of the factors in reimbursement rates.

> They're very real if you get a bill with them on it.

A number of providers give an automatic, no negotiation needed discount from the chargemaster to uninsured patients, and most of the rest expect to allow themselves to be negotiated down. The chargemaster isn't the real price, and has no consistent relationship to it across providers.

Re: Hospitals release lists of retail prices for services

#55

Post by EamonnMR »

These are the stick that they threaten to beat the uninsured with to bargan with insurance companies. The entire process is ridiculous, and while they can hide behind whatever they want to say the "real" prices are, these are the threat. "I won't pull this trigger, I'll just wave it in your face until they empty the cash register."

Re: Hospitals release lists of retail prices for services

#56

Post by EamonnMR »

zeroname wrote: post #50
abalone wrote: post #39

> Modern Healthcare decided to see how long it would take to present the data in a more consumer-friendly format. It took less than two hours Having been through several hundred thousand dollars of chargemaster charges with one of the hospitals on this list I can confidently say this info is not consumer-friendly at all. First of all, did anyone look at the damn PDFs? Do you have any idea what a "HCHG SP EVAL MTN FLU…

Medicare for all would easily bankrupt hospitals. The money needs to come from somewhere. Either force people to buy insurance or raise taxes massively. Pick your poison.

Another possibility is to reduce the cost of care.

Re: Hospitals release lists of retail prices for services

#57

Post by nickpsecurity »

Adam Ruins Everything has a skit on this for people who haven't heard of it:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CeDOQpfaUc8

On one of my non-insured years, I did get a five-digit bill like one in the video. Then some more from a bunch of other companies. It shouldn't have been legal. Especially given I couldn't exactly shop around for better prices with them all faking them.

Re: Hospitals release lists of retail prices for services

#58

Post by all2 »

bmogen wrote: post #48
all2 wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What other for profit corporations do this?

What other for-profit corporations operate within the premise of improving public health and have multiple federal agencies overseeing their operations?

My intent was not snarky, I actually would like to know if there are for-profit organizations that open their ledgers for regulatory purposes. I think its an interesting question, and there are implications if there is a precedent that health care organizations could follow.

Re: Hospitals release lists of retail prices for services

#59

Post by zeroname »

abalone wrote: post #53
zeroname wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Medicare for all would easily bankrupt hospitals. The money needs to come from somewhere. Either force people to buy insurance or raise taxes massively. Pick your poison.

Literally every other industrialized country has a Medicare For All type system and somehow the hospitals manage to stay open. And you can’t mention a tax increase without mentioning the savings of not having to pay for private insurance.

I am talking about actual Medicare, which causes big losses for hospitals. Those need to be covered, that is my point.

You can not just import other nations healthcare systems. Those are cheaper because the doctors and nurses earn less and the service is worse.

Re: Hospitals release lists of retail prices for services

#60

Post by nonbel »

EamonnMR wrote: post #55

These are the stick that they threaten to beat the uninsured with to bargan with insurance companies. The entire process is ridiculous, and while they can hide behind whatever they want to say the "real" prices are, these are the threat. "I won't pull this trigger, I'll just wave it in your face until they empty the cash register."

You've got it wrong. The uninsured don't pay these prices, the insurance companies don't pay them either.

The people getting screwed are those who pay a deductible/co-pay based on the inflated prices, ie the people who pay for health insurance.

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