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The Dangerous Fetishization of ‘Hustle Porn’

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Re: The Dangerous Fetishization of ‘Hustle Porn’

#51

Post by dasil003 »

JimboOmega wrote: post #28
exogeny wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly. Wake me up when Gary does a video on unit economics. Or cohort analysis. Or CAC/LTV. Or literally anything to do with business other than the idea that regardless of how unfit you are, how unsuitable your idea is, or how damaging the attempt will be on your personal finances or health, hustle is all you need. The winds are increasing against him. It's going to be interesting to watch him flip and suddenly pr…

Reminds of what happened with Inbox Zero. Didn't that guy wind up admitting he himself failed at it and it wasn't reasonable anyway? (Or am I getting confused with someone else?)

No, Merlin Mann distanced himself from Inbox Zero once it got picked up by the productivity porn blogger crowd who reduced it to yet another lifehack and lost the spirit of the idea which is that your inbox should not be your todo list because then you lose agency over your own priorities.

Re: The Dangerous Fetishization of ‘Hustle Porn’

#52

Post by manigandham »

exogeny wrote: post #10

There's nothing wrong with hard work. But there is a lot wrong with the idea that you need to work until your health is impacted to succeed; if you need to work that hard, something else is off - the idea isn't good enough, you're attacking it in the wrong way, whatever. To me this ties into the gross, pervasive trend of wantrepreneurism. Shark Tank, Zuck, Elon Musk - being a founder has never been sexier, never been…

Sometimes you do have to work that hard. Sacrificing personal health for some future gain for you (and your family) is not strange nor rare, it's reality for many people.

There's no moral judgement necessary as each individual can, and should, make that call for themselves. I only wish more had more opportunity to do so.

Re: The Dangerous Fetishization of ‘Hustle Porn’

#53

Post by autokad »

I disagree with the article.

I got nowhere fast in life by just sitting around waiting for things to happen. I had all sorts of excuses on why I wasn't succeeding, the article likes to supply plenty, and they are just poisonous thoughts.

then i lit a fire under my butt. I wanted to be a principle engineer, so I did research by looking at profiles on linkedin and found a masters at a great school would make that path easier. I spent time waiting in the subway, nights, and weekends studying and applied. I got rejected. I kept improving my application, I got accepted.

I changed my mind on what I wanted to be and wanted to be a data scientist, preferably a top tech. lots of rejections, lots of no response. took me years of trying different things and spending my nights and weekends doing kaggle competitions and learning. eventually I got what I wanted.

hustling alone didnt get me where I wanted to be, but resting around on my laurels and blaming other things for my lack of success would have done nothing. worse than nothing, it would have made me a bitter failure.

the article suggests the hustle culture is a symptom of a failed work system because people are afraid to loose their job. I disagree. I think its because many recognize we are in a rare window in time that we can do so much with our effort. we may have to change our expectations, we may have to fail a bit before we get there, but if we keep trying better things will happen.

Re: The Dangerous Fetishization of ‘Hustle Porn’

#54

Post by yesenadam »

exogeny wrote: post #34
userbinator wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

something else is off - the idea isn't good enough, you're attacking it in the wrong way, whatever. ...and don't forget the fact that seems almost taboo to say these days: you just don't have the ability.

Absolutely. I think about it in the same way I think about "American Idol": Simon Cowell became a notable figure simply because he was honest with people; he dared to tell people that they were wasting their time pursuing singing. Right now, Gary and all of these other hustle porn types are Paula Abdul. And they'll keep telling people that all they need to do is work harder, up until the point that it becomes to prof…

Well, not 'simply' for being honest, but for being (entertainingly) rude about it. You can be honest without being brutally honest, but it doesn't make such good TV I guess.

Re: The Dangerous Fetishization of ‘Hustle Porn’

#55

Post by manigandham »

Why must it be dangerous? Why are individuals not free to take inspiration where they find it?

It's true that much of the "hustle" advice is rarely actionable business strategies, but that's not much different from listening to music or having faith in a religion and finding guidance and support within. There's also endless amounts of education material for the people that seek it out, and if the push they need to do so comes from a cheesy video or quote then more power to them.

Is the judgement really necessary in all this? I find that much more counter-productive.

Re: The Dangerous Fetishization of ‘Hustle Porn’

#56

Post by walrus01 »

What I really don't get is people that will work themselves to death, 60-80 hours a week for products and market segments that I personally consider to be bullshit.

If you're under age 30 and working long hours building a dating site app, some iOS or Android game with pay-to-win mechanics, or writing software so that peoples' clicks on ads can be tracked better, are you really doing anything to improve the world?

There should not be an extreme sense of urgency and deadline-looming rush when what you're developing is a third rate clash of clans clone.

But I read all the time how the video game development industry pushes people like this, until they burn out. There was a huge scandal about the 3D artists employed by a studio which produced the animated comedy movie "sausage party":

https://www.google.com/search?client=ubuntu&channel=fs&q=sau...

With the benefit of age and 20 years of experience in the industry, I'm not going to go into "emergency rush" mode for anything short of an ACTUAL emergency.

Re: The Dangerous Fetishization of ‘Hustle Porn’

#57

Post by kryogen1c »

yesenadam wrote: post #54
exogeny wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Absolutely. I think about it in the same way I think about "American Idol": Simon Cowell became a notable figure simply because he was honest with people; he dared to tell people that they were wasting their time pursuing singing. Right now, Gary and all of these other hustle porn types are Paula Abdul. And they'll keep telling people that all they need to do is work harder, up until the point that it becomes to prof…

Well, not 'simply' for being honest, but for being (entertainingly) rude about it. You can be honest without being brutally honest, but it doesn't make such good TV I guess.

That depends on if you think people are naturally rational and without bias.

In reality, people often have to be forcibly dethroned from their views. Having a judge say no thanks will not have the appropriate effect.

The issue is emotional commitment, not accurate assessment.

Re: The Dangerous Fetishization of ‘Hustle Porn’

#58

Post by FooHentai »

exogeny wrote: post #10

There's nothing wrong with hard work. But there is a lot wrong with the idea that you need to work until your health is impacted to succeed; if you need to work that hard, something else is off - the idea isn't good enough, you're attacking it in the wrong way, whatever. To me this ties into the gross, pervasive trend of wantrepreneurism. Shark Tank, Zuck, Elon Musk - being a founder has never been sexier, never been…

It's a pretty pure example of Cargo Cult. If I shakalaka the 'hard work' stick hard enough, rainfall/supply planes/success will surely come.

It didn't rain? Must not have shaken the stick hard enough.

Re: The Dangerous Fetishization of ‘Hustle Porn’

#59

Post by itronitron »

exogeny wrote: post #23
ben_jones wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ultimately its peddling false hope with just enough of an inkling of truth to not be downright fraud. Like peddling health elixirs, magic diets, or the casino's w/l rate. It will get worse as income inequality (and desparation) grows.

Exactly. Wake me up when Gary does a video on unit economics. Or cohort analysis. Or CAC/LTV. Or literally anything to do with business other than the idea that regardless of how unfit you are, how unsuitable your idea is, or how damaging the attempt will be on your personal finances or health, hustle is all you need. The winds are increasing against him. It's going to be interesting to watch him flip and suddenly pr…

He'll probably become a spokesperson for Rent-A-Center before that happens.

Re: The Dangerous Fetishization of ‘Hustle Porn’

#60

Post by [deleted] »

ilamont wrote: post #24

There was an article discussed here on HN a few weeks back about "hustle culture" ( https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18381605 ) that encapsulated the trend in the ad industry, but this could apply in tech startups or many other businesses as well: To be clear, hustle isn’t just hard work — it’s showing that you’re working hard. It’s Instagram posts about how much you have to travel for work, it’s LinkedIn and Med…

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