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IQ Matters Less Than You Think

nautil.us

51–60 of 347 posts

Re: IQ Matters Less Than You Think

#51
It's funny, the article says that none of Terman's Termites became examplars of genius, but Lee Cronbach is definitely in the top 1% of most influential psychologists.

To name a few accomplishments..

* If wikipedia is correct, he was the "48th most cited psychologist as of 2002".

* He has an extremely popular metric named after him (Cronbach's alpha)

* President of American Psychological Association.

Maybe what he is missing to the author is the popular media appeal Feynman has. However, I'm not sure that's a good criterion for genius, since I'm not sure it's something Cronbach wanted.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lee_Cronbach

Re: IQ Matters Less Than You Think

#52
post #8

I want to believe that my perhaps above average IQ won't matter and I could be in a league of PhDs. But practically it seems very difficult and there is a glass ceiling which seems too difficult to break. A feeling that there is something which my mind cannot probably grasp.

It's all about learning more things, which in turn expands what you could possibly think - the human mind's ideas are limited to what it already knows or has experienced.

Learning new things expands that, allowing you to make new and unique connections between ideas.

Knowing more will help your future learning too - many ideas from separate fields are similar. Once you have learned one, your brain can easily learn the other ones, as it just maps the concept.

Many people have said it's about perseverance, My take on that is that it is perseverance in learning. I don't know what the IQ fuss is about. It's about as useless as all the other categorisations such as the Myers Briggs Personality Types.

Don't let yourself be categorised by a made up number, based on the ideas of the 1900s that have nowadays been mostly proven wrong or, at the very least, unreliable at best.

Learning and doing will break any glass ceilings you may think there are. The people who are at the top of their fields got there by years of excruciatingly hard work that is often forgotten. (forgotten not as in that it didn't matter, but as in people looking at them often think they just became top of their fields in a fortnight, and forget their actual life's journey that led them there)

Re: IQ Matters Less Than You Think

#53
post #7

“Nothing in this world can take the place of persistence. Talent will not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful men with talent. Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education will not; the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent. The slogan Press On! has solved and always will solve the problems of the human race.” ― Calvin Coolidge

With the danger of sounding conceited: I have lived this.

Me and my sister are polar opposites in everything, I’m lazy. She’s motivated. I tended to be above average when tested. She tended to be below average when tested. She wanted nothing more than being outside in nature and I wanted nothing more than being inside and messing with my computer.

Hell. Even down to the fact she has a boys name and I have a girls name (I’m a guy) and that I was skinny and she was not.

She is now a barrister, something that I could never have become. I was close to being a shelf-stocker at the UK equivalent of wal-mart but ironically they wouldn’t have me. If not for the fact that this industry is a huge bubble I would be on my arse. And why? Because I’m lazy and smart. And she is persistent and dumb.

I have tremendous respect for my sister, but it’s a fact that her success is down to her persistence. She never gives up. Even when people dump all over her for being slow or sounding thick. She’s awesome. We could all learn something from her.

Re: IQ Matters Less Than You Think

#54
post #31

Anyone who knows that their D&D Character with a 20 INT isn't invincible. You have to have a combination of scores in all of the attributes to succeed. Unfortunately, a lot of people don't apply this to real life. That being said, I often find that I over-think tasks, and end up never completing them because I try to make them perfect, and find out at some point that I can't. What's more important than "perfect" is "…

It's possible to play a 20 INT character if the rest of the cast is adjusted accordingly.

I have a theory that a lot of highly successful people have either a partner or a team that is willing to do the grunt work. They basically have/created a surrounding that allows them to focus on what they do best. The media will picture how that person is so smart and great, but without the proper environment they wouldn't be able to thrive.

Smart people have a tendency to think they can do everything on their own because they are so smart, which is quite stupid actually.

Re: IQ Matters Less Than You Think

#55
post #7

“Nothing in this world can take the place of persistence. Talent will not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful men with talent. Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education will not; the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent. The slogan Press On! has solved and always will solve the problems of the human race.” ― Calvin Coolidge

Like all quotes, on first glance it appears insightful and impressive, but a closer second look reveals it to be nonsense.

> Nothing in this world can take the place of persistence.

Luck and circumstance can.

> Talent will not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful men with talent. Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education will not; the world is full of educated derelicts.

The world is also full of persistent failures as well.

> Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent.

The Axis powers in ww2 were as persistent and determined as the allies. You could argue they were even more persistent and determined. They failed. Has there been a more persistent and determined presidential candidate than Hillary Clinton? She failed twice. If persistence was all it took, Hillary would have been president.

People love to pat themselves on the back for their successes. If coolidge was born into a black family in the 1800s rather than into an elite new england family, I wonder how much persistence and determination would have mattered.

Persistence is an important characteristic in life, but there are far more to success than persistence.

Re: IQ Matters Less Than You Think

#56
post #34

Can someone do a test for willpower/hardwork? I think that would be a useful indicator. I was a B student, but I've accomplished more than A students now that I'm approaching my 30s.

Willpower has a standard test, at least in kids: put a sweet in front of them, tell them to not eat it, leave them alone with it, and see how long it takes them to eat it anyway. For adults, I propose giving them a mobile phone and a Twitter account, and seeing how long it takes for them to “just check it one more time”.

Geez,I guess I’ve always had infinite willpower. /s

I wasn’t a fan of sweets as a kid, and I don’t have a Twitter account.

That said, I think that these, or some minor variation thereof, are fairly good and simple tests of willpower.

Re: IQ Matters Less Than You Think

#58

I wonder how many IQ test misclassify intelligence? Feynman had a score of 125 and many people here have a high score than that. I bet no one here with a higher score of 125 are actually smarter than Feynman though. I think this is just one of many possible such examples where IQ test miss the purported people they were suppose to capture. Feynman’s score wouldn’t even qualify him for MENSA. I wonder how many IQ exam…

Furthermore, most IQ tests are not meant to measure intelligence past a certain point. A person with an IQ of 160 is not inherently smarter than someone who has an IQ of 150 in the same way someone with an IQ of 100 is inherently smarter than someone with an IQ of 90.

Re: IQ Matters Less Than You Think

#59
There's an unspoken assumption in this discussion that ability, however it is defined, leads inevitably to success, whatever that means. Then you're looking at whether IQ is a good measurement of ability in the first instance (is it often wrong in what it is trying to measure it not?) And whether it is trying to measure the right thing or is ability elsewhere unmeasured?

Nowhere in all of it is dumb luck considered a factor. Lottery winners are successful. What can you infer about their personality attributes? It's obviously risible.

At the other end of the scale is there ability so profound that considering the role of luck is uninteresting? Or are there N others with comparable ability who weren't so fortunate and did not succeed? How big is that N? Is it possible to answer such questions with anything more than prejudice? Do you have to get lucky with your research to get a Nobel? Eg would Feynmann have got one for something else if QED was published by someone else a couple of years before he got there? Don Bradman was lucky to achieve what he did in sports, really?

My own prejudice is that IQ is total bullshit. I believe in my ability and was once told as a child that my IQ was impressive (whatever that meant - I don't know). I know I mirror my parents reaction to that news: "We think you're clever and always did, just not because of this nonsense."

Maybe I'm not super remarkable too and who cares? Life is too short. All of us should rise early, work hard and strike oil.

Re: IQ Matters Less Than You Think

#60

I wonder how many IQ test misclassify intelligence? Feynman had a score of 125 and many people here have a high score than that. I bet no one here with a higher score of 125 are actually smarter than Feynman though. I think this is just one of many possible such examples where IQ test miss the purported people they were suppose to capture. Feynman’s score wouldn’t even qualify him for MENSA. I wonder how many IQ exam…

my guess is that a well designed IQ test actually tests what it tests for with good accuracy/precision. i am skeptical that the IQ criteria are very close to what we consider "intelligence".
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