AUTHOR'S MAIN PROBLEM: "Programming for me was never supposed to be more than a means to an end..."
Your weakness disgusts me so much...
My life with 12 programmers, 2 rooms and one 21st-century dream (2016)
51–60 of 181 posts
Re: My life with 12 programmers, 2 rooms and one 21st-century dream (2016)
#52It's a weird story for me and I have absolutely no understanding for it. (no, I don't mean tolerance) I'm not from the US and am far from any startup experience, but I am a young programmer myself, without either good budget nor education. Programming is the love my life but I would never bear this situation at any cost for it. He states himself that programming was just "means to an end" for him. So why even bother?…
>He states himself that programming was just "means to an end" for him. So why even bother? Because you gotta pay the bills somehow. This is something you only ever hear from people in our profession and I think it sometimes leads to self-exploitation. Nobody would ever say "He states himself that driving the garbage truck was just "means to an end" for him. So why even bother?"
But, hopefully, and rarely nobody has to live in that conditions to drive a garbage truck.
There is so many stuff out there he he could've paid the bills with, why did it had to be programming in this kind of experience?
Re: My life with 12 programmers, 2 rooms and one 21st-century dream (2016)
#53MAIN ISSUE: "Programming for me was never supposed to be more than a means to an end..."
YOUR WEAKNESS DISGUSTS ME
Re: My life with 12 programmers, 2 rooms and one 21st-century dream (2016)
#54This part struck me as so sad: > Programming for me was never supposed to be more than a means to an end Programming is one of my favorite things to do and I do it even when my job is something else. Why do it if you don't like it? No wonder it seemed hopeless.
>Why do it if you don't like it? Uhh, because it pays well, has good job security and benefits, doesn't require multiple degrees, is respected socially, isn't physically intensive, etc. etc. Most all of my non-programmer friends don't really like their jobs all that much, so if you're not passionate about anything else, my question is why not go into software development?
A lot of people these days think like this. It means that software developers tend to be money oriented these days and it often affects code quality in a negative way.
Producing bad code is more lucrative for the developer than producing good code.
Re: My life with 12 programmers, 2 rooms and one 21st-century dream (2016)
#55This really is only one small segment of the programming population. I really hate superficial shit like this that paints tech workers in a bad light bc most have ordinary jobs and live ordinary lives and aren’t social recluses. I work typical 9-5, wife and kids. We go grocery shopping and make dinner every night together. We live very modestly and we have lots of non-tech friends and family. It’s literaly nothing sp…
Agree with you. I work in bay area...normal hours 40-50 per week. May be avg pay but way higher quality life.
Re: My life with 12 programmers, 2 rooms and one 21st-century dream (2016)
#56Earlier quoted context omitted.
Haha, I could go back, except for maybe my pride. I only left for what I thought was a good opportunity personally. (still up for debate on whether it was or not). I don't hate my current job, but my current employer has reached out to most devs on my old team and I've made sure to contact them and explain that it's a huge mistake to leave. Life is still good. My schedule is still fantastic, but I am missing that cer…
We call it a "boomerang" where I work, and it's not a sign of failure-- it's something we celebrate. We get a lot of boomerangs who leave for a year or two and then come back to work with us again. It's the highest form of flattery when they like us so much they come back. :)
My previous company hated it. The leaders perceived those who leave as disloyal and always felt deeply insulted whenever someone left. For instance, I run into them at conferences every year and they don’t even acknowledge my presence, even though I was on really good terms with them when I worked there. It’s pretty bizarre.
Re: My life with 12 programmers, 2 rooms and one 21st-century dream (2016)
#57I know the author wised up and moved on, but I would rather work construction for the rest of my life than be a programmer and live like this. I worked for a startup for a couple of years that really got it right. The CTO really wanted a certain lead developer as his first hire (they had previously worked together) and the lead dev said (paraphrased, of course) "Nope. Not interested in working more than 40 hours per…
This is a good way to work. I am hugely skeptical about places that have a culture of crazy long work weeks from a pure productivity standpoint.
When we 'rebooted' Sensory Networks (our regex company a while back) we held to a 'regular hours only' policy and I think we did pretty well with it. We did get to a decent acquisition (esp. for a niche product) and importantly we were able to keep progressing the product technically. I suspect that 60-70 hour work weeks lead to a lot of technical debt that will require more 60-70 hour work weeks to pay back.
Re: My life with 12 programmers, 2 rooms and one 21st-century dream (2016)
#58This is of course in no way representative. If you are a software developer in SF you get very quickly to $140k+. That guy in the closet was probably stashing way North of $60k annually, not counting equity. Do this for 7-10 years and you can retire silver else and are probably in your early 30s. If you work at FAANG you can easily take home way North of $200k. No reason to rent a illegal closet at that point unless…
>>That guy in the closet was probably stashing way North of $60k annually, not counting equity. Do this for 7-10 years and you can retire silver else and are probably in your early 30s.
Retire with $750k (assuming stock market gains over that 10 years)? Man, I don’t know many people who can do that, at least not in the US.
Don’t get me wrong, it gets you out of the “work or starve” level, but it’s also not exactly “I don’t have to work a day the rest of my life” money.
Re: My life with 12 programmers, 2 rooms and one 21st-century dream (2016)
#59Earlier quoted context omitted.
>Why do it if you don't like it? Uhh, because it pays well, has good job security and benefits, doesn't require multiple degrees, is respected socially, isn't physically intensive, etc. etc. Most all of my non-programmer friends don't really like their jobs all that much, so if you're not passionate about anything else, my question is why not go into software development?
A lot of people these days think like this. It means that software developers tend to be money oriented these days and it often affects code quality in a negative way. Producing bad code is more lucrative for the developer than producing good code.
Almost all programmers I know are not passionate about their jobs. It's a job, not their life. Yet they write good code and deliver on schedule. Outside of the HN filter bubble this is perfectly normal. Insinuating that people intentionally write bad code for monetary reasons is rude imho.
It's like this for the vast majority of jobs, inside and outside of tech. People do them because they have to pay their bills and come home to their family and their hobbies.
Re: My life with 12 programmers, 2 rooms and one 21st-century dream (2016)
#60is REMOTE a strong word ?