American Cities Are Drowning in Car Storage • Hacker News Board

Re: American Cities Are Drowning in Car Storage

#51

Post by mandeepj » Sat, Jul 14, 2018, 5:19 PM UTC

mattlondon wrote: post #34

I always thought it was weird how there is so much parking in the centre of US cities. When I talk to colleagues in various US cities and they say they drive to work it just Does. Not. Compute . In central London, driving to work is essentially unheard of unless you are the Prime Minister. There is parking available in London, but the prices are fairly high - I just had a quick look on parkopedia [1] and it looks lik…

Part of it is - England is so small compared to US, which means everything is close by. Here in US, we have so much land which makes things scattered away. Hard to cover each route via public transport on such a large area

Re: American Cities Are Drowning in Car Storage

#52

Post by ulfw » Sat, Jul 14, 2018, 5:20 PM UTC

runarberg wrote: post #44

ebikelaw wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Kind of a weird argument that nobody wants to take the bus or the train because it's too crowded. Very Berra.

Take the Sound Transit 550. It is the main (only direct?) busline between downtown Seattle and Bellevue. During rush hour it comes at an interval of 10 - 15 min. The bus it self is a double wagon (with an accordion connection), it fits maybe (beware I'm pulling this figure from thin air) 50 people. It is always crowded with people standing back to front. During these 10 - 15 minutes one can only imagine how many peop…

10-15 mins is a loooong wait during rush hour. Subways come every 2 mins in Hong Kong at that time. There's no reason (besides Seattle not wanting to spend the money obviously) not to bring down those times to say 2-5 minutes and tripling to quadrupling the amount of buses on said route.

Re: American Cities Are Drowning in Car Storage

#53

Post by mattlondon » Sat, Jul 14, 2018, 5:20 PM UTC

Derived wrote: post #45

mattlondon wrote: post #34

I always thought it was weird how there is so much parking in the centre of US cities. When I talk to colleagues in various US cities and they say they drive to work it just Does. Not. Compute . In central London, driving to work is essentially unheard of unless you are the Prime Minister. There is parking available in London, but the prices are fairly high - I just had a quick look on parkopedia [1] and it looks lik…

It's that expensive because of the population density and government meddling. There's no need for that in the US...are you saying we should artificially charge the pants off of everyone driving to work just to force them to use public transport? Why? I like my car. I like driving my car. I don't want to ride a train, or a bus. If I can work to the office, I will. I'll drive everywhere else.

The "Why" is pollution is really high, and the traffic is awful. Everyone loses.

Re: American Cities Are Drowning in Car Storage

#54

Post by dsnuh » Sat, Jul 14, 2018, 5:20 PM UTC

stretchwithme wrote: post #10

Once automated vehicles take over (eventually), most people will switch to taxis. Taking taxis everywhere will be cheaper than owning your own vehicle. So the need to park will be greatly reduced. Eventually, mass transit will fail and underground subways will be repurposed for AVs. Parking will be built underground for off peak storage of vehicles, allowing the repurposing of surface parking spots. Maybe agricultura…

Every time I hear this notion that autonomous vehicles will replace private car ownership in the U.S., it strikes me as a futurist pipe dream. I think truly autonomous vehicles are a long way away, if ever. The capital and construction required to totally rearrange the average American city to get to the scenarios you describe would be incredible. I also think we are underestimating the cultural aspect of car ownership in America, as another commenter above pointed out.

Re: American Cities Are Drowning in Car Storage

#55

Post by matthewowen » Sat, Jul 14, 2018, 5:20 PM UTC

mattlondon wrote: post #34

I always thought it was weird how there is so much parking in the centre of US cities. When I talk to colleagues in various US cities and they say they drive to work it just Does. Not. Compute . In central London, driving to work is essentially unheard of unless you are the Prime Minister. There is parking available in London, but the prices are fairly high - I just had a quick look on parkopedia [1] and it looks lik…

Outside of London, the majority of people in the UK drive to work.

Likewise, the majority of people commuting to (eg) Manhattan don't drive to work.

When someone in Houston says that they drive to work, the comparison isn't to someone working in Central London. It's to someone who lives who works in the outskirts of Birmingham.

I think the US is too car dependent. But from my experience, outside of London the UK is pretty terrible too.

Re: American Cities Are Drowning in Car Storage

#56

Post by captainmuon » Sat, Jul 14, 2018, 5:21 PM UTC

amelius wrote: post #28

Self-driving cars will solve the whole parking problem.

Yeah some idiots would just let their car drive around all the time without them. I remember reading an article that they wanted to make a law specifically against this before it happens, but I can't find the link. Now if people can share the autonomous cars, that's a different story.

Re: American Cities Are Drowning in Car Storage

#57

Post by radiantswirl » Sat, Jul 14, 2018, 5:22 PM UTC

christiangenco wrote: post #49

erikpukinskis wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is how we have had such economic growth. We use our own population as a testbed where we disintermediate all of our own cultural support systems so that everything must be hired out. Food, transport, entertainment, self concept, family, all of it has been reformed in the U.S. over the last 100 years to replace community labor with commercial relations. This means we get first dibs on these new industries (Softwa…

This is the first time I've heard the phrase "Guiltlessness As A Service" - from a google search I think it may be your own term? Regardless, I like it. I think you're using it to describe businesses that do things like sell carbon credits or do humanitarian work?

Companies with an "eco" or "humanitarian" angle are rly just selling newfangled Catholic indulgences.

Re: American Cities Are Drowning in Car Storage

#58

Post by microcolonel » Sat, Jul 14, 2018, 5:23 PM UTC

Semirhage wrote: post #26

I’m from Italy, and until I lived in America for a while I’d never understood just how massive the US really is. I lived on two coasts, in two states that were both much larger than my entire country! People like to point to Berlin or Paris as model cities, but they’re population centers in countries that could fit inside Texas without making a splash. I’m not saying that US car culture is entirely healthy, or that i…

For some, the grass is always greener on the other side. It is stylish today to criticize every tradeoff the U.S. has made in order to credibly claim that every habitable square foot of every state is "inhabited", but a lot of it makes perfect sense.

There is one piece of public transit which makes a lot of sense in the U.S.: the bus (both local and coach buses), but it is unstylish and so gets no attention.

Imagine how much better it would be getting from city to city if the money that went into subsidizing AmTrak (which approximately nobody uses, least of which the lower classes) was available as a grant or credit for every passenger mile on the already-thriving network of American bus carriers (Greyhound, Megabus, and 24 others in the long-distance category alone).

Re: American Cities Are Drowning in Car Storage

#59

Post by wflann » Sat, Jul 14, 2018, 5:23 PM UTC

Derived wrote: post #45

mattlondon wrote: post #34

I always thought it was weird how there is so much parking in the centre of US cities. When I talk to colleagues in various US cities and they say they drive to work it just Does. Not. Compute . In central London, driving to work is essentially unheard of unless you are the Prime Minister. There is parking available in London, but the prices are fairly high - I just had a quick look on parkopedia [1] and it looks lik…

It's that expensive because of the population density and government meddling. There's no need for that in the US...are you saying we should artificially charge the pants off of everyone driving to work just to force them to use public transport? Why? I like my car. I like driving my car. I don't want to ride a train, or a bus. If I can work to the office, I will. I'll drive everywhere else.

Government meddling on government-build roads?

Re: American Cities Are Drowning in Car Storage

#60

Post by extradego » Sat, Jul 14, 2018, 5:23 PM UTC

erikpukinskis wrote: post #16

angarg12 wrote: post #2

I visited the US (particularly the bay area) for the first time recently, and I was baffled by the sparsity of buildings. Suburbs and shopping areas are so far away that you need a car to go anywhere, and in turn you need massive expanses to held all those vehicles, which means that stores are even more spread apart, which essentially becomes a snowball. Being used to high density housing and underground parking spac…

This is how we have had such economic growth. We use our own population as a testbed where we disintermediate all of our own cultural support systems so that everything must be hired out. Food, transport, entertainment, self concept, family, all of it has been reformed in the U.S. over the last 100 years to replace community labor with commercial relations. This means we get first dibs on these new industries (Softwa…

Right on the money.

Before WW2, America was a culture desert. Europeans fleeing the war are the only reason NYC became an international culture hub.

Hip-hop is undoubtedly the most progressive Western art form. (Side note: hip-hop's genius appropriations of commercial symbolisms and it's will to collective empowerment directly underwrite and provide the language of the public engagement of today's millenials. It's influence is as deep as an ocean.) But while hip-hop is the only non-native wholly American cultural movement, it's American origins are a far cry from enlightment; more bound in shame. To say America created hip-hop would be an offense. Saying America stole it would be more accurate.