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The Pentagon Is Building a Team of Tech-Savvy Soldiers

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Re: The Pentagon Is Building a Team of Tech-Savvy Soldiers

#51

Post by adventured »

wmeredith wrote: post #13
arkis22 wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The largest portion of our taxes does not go to defense spending. It goes to entitlements.

Absolutely. 62% of the budget goes to social security, Medicare, and Medicaid. The rest is discretionary spending and a bit more than half of that goes to “defense”. Source: https://www.thebalance.com/u-s-federal-budget-breakdown-3305...

That's just the federal budget. US taxes & spending include local + state + federal.

Leaving off the other $3.x trillion in taxation & spending, nearly an entire other federal government, paints a very incomplete picture.

The military is 10% of all government spending in the US. Total government spending is around $7.2 trillion for 2018.

Re: The Pentagon Is Building a Team of Tech-Savvy Soldiers

#52

Post by j9461701 »

adventured wrote: post #49
j9461701 wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>You gave an account for a single situation, which is completely different from the normal business: Being caught in a minefield under fire The first hand account is the former Israeli NCO paratrooper, the mine field example is just an illustration for why the military retains that style of management despite its problems. >Using that anecdote to somehow say "the whole military is" is not even a stretch anymore, it's…

> The first hand account is the former Israeli NCO paratrooper The worst paratrooper they ever had, per their own admission. The US does not train the same way Israel does. Which does not train the same way China does, or Germany does, and so on.

>The worst paratrooper they ever had, per their own admission.

Because he wasn't suited to military style leadership. So he became a software dev instead, and he enjoyed that much more.

Still, this is a fair point.

>The US does not train the same way Israel does. Which does not train the same way China does, or Germany does, and so on.

The IDF is, as I said above, famous for its individualism and relatively lax standards of discipline by Western military standards. I suppose having fought several huge wars of national survival within living memory makes you throw all the superfluous authoritarianism out the window and retain only those parts of it which are essential to function.

So if even they are still very heavy on authority and instant obedience, the US isn't going to be any better. Nor, especially, would China who follow the Russian school of top-down control compared to the Western emphasis on bottom up (aka mission-style tactics the other fellow linked to).

Re: The Pentagon Is Building a Team of Tech-Savvy Soldiers

#53

Post by Merad »

gbhn wrote: post #28
wmeredith wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eh, look at it as a filter for true believers. Mercenaries are dangerous, because they have a price.

Perhaps a better analogy: let's say you're hiring people with the offer that you'll pay them $2M the first year, then nothing for 20 years. The danger is that the person will quit. So it is more conservative to offer a deal where you pay them nothing for 20 years, then $2M. Then you're pretty sure they'll stay, especially if they're 15 years in. I think that's probably the best way to understand the salary/pension tr…

Do civilian government employees even get a pension plan anymore? I got an offer a few years back from a three letter agency in DC and I'm pretty sure they just had a 401k.

Re: The Pentagon Is Building a Team of Tech-Savvy Soldiers

#54

Post by j9461701 »

chrisseaton wrote: post #50
j9461701 wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>This is a huge misconception people have about the military. I just gave you a first hand account of it, and a concrete illustration of it is the current topic of discussion. It's difficult to call what is being clearly demonstrated through multiple channels "a huge misconception". Especially considering this is an Israeli NCO saying this, when the Israelis have a reputation for actually being one of the most indivi…

> I just gave you a first hand account of it From someone who describes themselves as being very bad at the job! Maybe this was what he was getting wrong? > when an officer says "Jump" an enlisted man jumps rather than trying to argue This is what people get wrong. When an officer says 'jump' the enlisted man actually responds 'tell me what you want me to achieve, sir, then it's my job to decide how I want to make it…

>From someone who describes themselves as being very bad at the job! Maybe this was what he was getting wrong?

Perhaps. He was really awful at the whole "military discipline" part of being in the military. Now he's a software developer, so that all worked out for him.

>This is what people get wrong. When an officer says 'jump' the enlisted man actually responds 'tell me what you want me to achieve, sir, then it's my job to decide how I want to make it happen whether that's jumping or something else'.

I personally only have 2nd hand accounts of the interaction from the officer's side, so I may well be getting it wrong.

My physics classes had a few navy guys in them, who were trying to get...something or other, they needed a degree in a hard science to get a promotion. I don't really know what exactly. Anyway, being really interested in ships I talked their ear off about everything whenever they'd let me. And the topic of ordering men around was always treated with a certain...presumption that every word they said would be instantly obeyed without question. Stand here and look over there at the horizon until I say otherwise sailor. Scrape this wall with this scrapper sailor, and then paint it over. Carry this crate below decks, no stopping sailor. Inventory the armory sailor, mop the deck sailor, etc. etc.

Re: The Pentagon Is Building a Team of Tech-Savvy Soldiers

#55

Post by [deleted] »

chrisseaton wrote: post #50
j9461701 wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>This is a huge misconception people have about the military. I just gave you a first hand account of it, and a concrete illustration of it is the current topic of discussion. It's difficult to call what is being clearly demonstrated through multiple channels "a huge misconception". Especially considering this is an Israeli NCO saying this, when the Israelis have a reputation for actually being one of the most indivi…

> I just gave you a first hand account of it From someone who describes themselves as being very bad at the job! Maybe this was what he was getting wrong? > when an officer says "Jump" an enlisted man jumps rather than trying to argue This is what people get wrong. When an officer says 'jump' the enlisted man actually responds 'tell me what you want me to achieve, sir, then it's my job to decide how I want to make it…

[deleted]

Re: The Pentagon Is Building a Team of Tech-Savvy Soldiers

#56

Post by adamdrake »

j9461701 wrote: post #33
throwaway129386 wrote: post #14

As someone who works for the Defense Department I found this article totally unsurprising. This sort of story is common. The question people should be asking is why does it take a 3-star general's blessing in order to get a team functioning computers that are usable for something besides Email and Microsoft Office. Another major obstacle that isn't touched on in this article is buying things. Typical timeline for pur…

I think this article does a wonderful job explaining why the military is built the way it is: https://www.joelonsoftware.com/2006/08/08/the-command-and-co... If Command and Control is such a bad way to run a team, why does the military use it? This was explained to me in NCO school. I was in the Israeli paratroopers in 1986. Probably the worst paratrooper they ever had, now that I think back. There are several standi…

As has been mentioned, this is a common (albeit incorrect) use/understanding of what Command and Control actually is.

I wrote an article some time ago to reframe this in a business context: https://adamdrake.com/command-and-control.html

In short, when all startups are complaining that people don't show initiative/don't have alignment/etc. what they're really saying is that they have inadequate Command and Control!

These approaches and processes for keeping people working together with unity of purpose towards a series of objectives have been refined over thousands of years and under the most difficult circumstances. Ignore them at your (and your team's) peril.

Re: The Pentagon Is Building a Team of Tech-Savvy Soldiers

#57

Post by yardie »

Merad wrote: post #53
gbhn wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps a better analogy: let's say you're hiring people with the offer that you'll pay them $2M the first year, then nothing for 20 years. The danger is that the person will quit. So it is more conservative to offer a deal where you pay them nothing for 20 years, then $2M. Then you're pretty sure they'll stay, especially if they're 15 years in. I think that's probably the best way to understand the salary/pension tr…

Do civilian government employees even get a pension plan anymore? I got an offer a few years back from a three letter agency in DC and I'm pretty sure they just had a 401k.

I believe so. Federal employees don’t pay social security so their only fixed income will come from their government pension.

Re: The Pentagon Is Building a Team of Tech-Savvy Soldiers

#58

Post by w0uld »

solidsnack9000 wrote: post #30
tdhz77 wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I work for federal government. And the government subsidies my pay @ $4500 to live in DC. I’m humbled by my opportunity to be in the public service. I’ve turned down valley jobs. US gov is filled with highly qualified people. You just don’t know their twitter.

They add $4500 per month to live in DC?

I believe that is per year.

Re: The Pentagon Is Building a Team of Tech-Savvy Soldiers

#59

Post by martzcodes »

yardie wrote: post #57
Merad wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do civilian government employees even get a pension plan anymore? I got an offer a few years back from a three letter agency in DC and I'm pretty sure they just had a 401k.

I believe so. Federal employees don’t pay social security so their only fixed income will come from their government pension.

Yes they do. In the old system they didn't, but everyone since ~1984 does (and most of the old-system folks are retired or near retirement now.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/federal-eye/post/federa...

Re: The Pentagon Is Building a Team of Tech-Savvy Soldiers

#60

Post by rtkwe »

zachruss92 wrote: post #5

I really enjoyed this article. The DDS is literally doing the same kind of things that the USDS is doing, but for military applications. Given the fact that the largest portion of our taxes goes towards defense spending, initiatives like create opportunities to allocate resources more efficiently, iterate with agility, and save a ton of money. When you look at DoD contractors, there is obviously a motivation on their…

Philadelphia's transit authority SEPTA has been rolling out a cashless fare system using RFID/NFC. It was supposed to be released in 2013 and still isn't complete. It cost $300 Million for Xerox to build which was twice as much as the initial budget. The kicker is their website used isn't even functional on mobile - it _literally_ uses nested tables for layout. A more efficient way to do this would be to use your phone for everything (using built in NFC) and an app to manage your fares.

NFC still isn't 100% available on all smartphones and really wasn't whenever the system was designed. Particularly the cheaper smartphones used by lower income people are more likely to not have NFC even today. Back in 2010 when the system was first conceived (assuming based on 2013 release date) NFC was even rarer.

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