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SEC filing suggests MoviePass’ time is running out

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Re: SEC filing suggests MoviePass’ time is running out

#51

Post by smacktoward »

dwighttk wrote: post #2

It doesn't seem to be the sort of thing that even has a chance of being profitable... The only reason to join is to save money on tickets, the only way they make money is if people spend more on membership fees than the tickets they buy.

The play is to get enough users fast enough so that MoviePass sits between the theater chains and a big chunk of their customer base. Once that happens, MoviePass can start squeezing the theaters to discount the prices MP pays for tickets with threats of taking their theaters out of the MP system if they won't. If the MoviePass user base is a big enough fraction of the overall theatergoing population, the theaters will have to accept whatever price MoviePass offers them for tickets or risk losing access to their customers and kneecapping their business.

This is a long-term, Amazon-style play: burning capital up front to establish a commanding market position, at which point you can start raking it in by charging monopolist rents. But it assumes you can build a big enough user base to start dictating terms before you run out of capital, and if you can't, the whole thing falls apart pretty quickly.

Re: SEC filing suggests MoviePass’ time is running out

#53

Post by adamc »

slg wrote: post #43
emodendroket wrote: post #7

> When the company changed those rules to limit subscribers so they could only see a given movie once, no matter how long it runs in theaters, a support ticket stated, “we hope this will encourage you to see new movies and enjoy something different!” It turns out that was a blatant effort to cut costs, with today’s filing explaining that the move “enabled us to reduce our cash deficit during the first week of May 201…

Since MoviePass buys it tickets at retail costs, a single heavy user is exceptionally costly. Imagine someone who purchases a $15 ticket 25 times a month for a total of $375. MoviePass would need something like 40 users paying $10 a month who barely use the service in order to offset that single user. It therefore isn't surprising that MoviePass is making changes to curtail those heavy users. Even if only something l…

Buying its tickets at retail cost is crazy...

Re: SEC filing suggests MoviePass’ time is running out

#54

Post by salvar »

emodendroket wrote: post #15
cletus wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Abuse" is a strong word and the quote you've given addresses this when it says: > ... whose astounding box-office performance is driven by repeat visits I think you underestimate how often people will see the same movie. Getting tickets for your friends for MoviePass is a whole separate issue (and clearly abuse). But is seeing the same movie more than once "abuse"? That's more debatable. But repeat viewings clearly…

If more than one-third of their ticket purchases are repeat viewings I find it really hard to believe anywhere near half of those are genuine, rather than tickets purchased for someone else. Anyway, it seems like a completely reasonable restriction to not allow someone to see the same movie more than once.

It's not one-third of their ticket purchases. Limiting the viewings to one per movie reduced the cash deficit by 35%. These are not the same at all.

Re: SEC filing suggests MoviePass’ time is running out

#55

Post by jankassens »

vincentmarle wrote: post #41

In the Netherlands we have our own “MoviePass” (called Pathé Unlimited) started by the country’s biggest theater chain (Pathé) since the early 2000s, so the concept is definitely not new to us, I was actually surprised to learn that Cinemark didn’t have their own subscription model when I moved here since it worked really well in Europe (both for customers and for Pathé). The reason why the model works for Pathé and…

It also appears to be EUR 20 per month. MoviePass is less then half that at USD 10. Often less then a single regular movie ticket.

Re: SEC filing suggests MoviePass’ time is running out

#56

Post by dingaling »

coss wrote: post #19
untog wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do know people who go to see the latest movies (particularly Marvel ones, Star Wars, etc.) more than once. I imagine MoviePass would only encourage that behavior. (but I agree that abuse probably has something to do with it as well)

I really don't see how theaters haven't caught on and started a subscription service of their own. Just an obvious way to get people to the theater (multiple times) and by snacks.

Odeon chain in the UK have a subscription with unlimited(ish) viewing

http://mobi.odeon.co.uk/limitless/

I don't go to the cinema often enough to make it worthwhile but it is popular with my peers.

Re: SEC filing suggests MoviePass’ time is running out

#57

Post by hkmurakami »

emodendroket wrote: post #7

> When the company changed those rules to limit subscribers so they could only see a given movie once, no matter how long it runs in theaters, a support ticket stated, “we hope this will encourage you to see new movies and enjoy something different!” It turns out that was a blatant effort to cut costs, with today’s filing explaining that the move “enabled us to reduce our cash deficit during the first week of May 201…

Back when Titanic came out, some classmates of mine saw the movie 9 times in theaters.

Abuse is likely a big factor but there are likely some honest actors in there too.

Re: SEC filing suggests MoviePass’ time is running out

#58

Post by mattnewton »

vincentmarle wrote: post #41

In the Netherlands we have our own “MoviePass” (called Pathé Unlimited) started by the country’s biggest theater chain (Pathé) since the early 2000s, so the concept is definitely not new to us, I was actually surprised to learn that Cinemark didn’t have their own subscription model when I moved here since it worked really well in Europe (both for customers and for Pathé). The reason why the model works for Pathé and…

S/condiments/concessions? Thanks for the take, that makes a lot of sense. Maybe movie pass will be bought / cloned by a theatre chain here.

Re: SEC filing suggests MoviePass’ time is running out

#59

Post by emodendroket »

losvedir wrote: post #49
emodendroket wrote: post #7

> When the company changed those rules to limit subscribers so they could only see a given movie once, no matter how long it runs in theaters, a support ticket stated, “we hope this will encourage you to see new movies and enjoy something different!” It turns out that was a blatant effort to cut costs, with today’s filing explaining that the move “enabled us to reduce our cash deficit during the first week of May 201…

I saw Black Panther three times in theaters with my MoviePass because, well, why not? The only theater near me only has 5 screens (I live in a small town), so my wife and I end up with some repeat viewings. That said, I love MoviePass but know it's not sustainable. I wish they had rolled out these changes earlier. Something like no repeat viewings, 8 movies per month, different price depending on where you live (tick…

I can't see the appeal of watching a movie I literally just watched.

Re: SEC filing suggests MoviePass’ time is running out

#60

Post by dbatten »

Wasn't there some article a while back about how MoviePass was trying to have a big enough market-share in terms of movie-goers (read: popcorn and soda revenue for theaters) to be able to start pushing theaters around? In other words, they could say to theater companies "hey, maybe you should think about giving us tickets at a discount so you don't lose out on that sweet sweet concession money." Or maybe even play one theater brand off against another?

I wonder if theaters have figured this is a waiting game and they can just let MoviePass die and go back to business as usual...

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