Question. How is that even knowing the lifecycle of HIV at this level of detail, there is not a cure for it?
Ha, my thoughts were similar to yours but in the opposite direction: With such complicated machinery being involved in every part of micro biology, how can humans ever hope to cure anything? Everything down there is so complex, fast and intricate and we're stuck up here able to interact with it only in the most brute force and imprecise ways.
The life cycle of HIV in 3D [video]
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Re: The life cycle of HIV in 3D [video]
#52Re: The life cycle of HIV in 3D [video]
#53As a technologist, I have mixed feelings when I see the fascinating details of life. On one hand, mastering this molecular machine would give us literally God-like powers: we could fabricate, grow or heal anything. We could solve all current problems, we could terraform planets using a few milligrams of DNA and literally redefine what it means to be human. On the other, I see the human body as a completely unsecured…
> power to kill every human on the planet. Truly God-like powers. You can't really design a perfect virus that will wipe out the human race, because anything you do to affect its properties will also affect its ability to spread. I'd be way more concerned about the destructive power of nuclear weapons, still numerous enough to destroy a very large part of humanity and our vital infrastructures.
Re: The life cycle of HIV in 3D [video]
#54As a technologist, I have mixed feelings when I see the fascinating details of life. On one hand, mastering this molecular machine would give us literally God-like powers: we could fabricate, grow or heal anything. We could solve all current problems, we could terraform planets using a few milligrams of DNA and literally redefine what it means to be human. On the other, I see the human body as a completely unsecured…
> power to kill every human on the planet. Truly God-like powers. You can't really design a perfect virus that will wipe out the human race, because anything you do to affect its properties will also affect its ability to spread. I'd be way more concerned about the destructive power of nuclear weapons, still numerous enough to destroy a very large part of humanity and our vital infrastructures.
A highly engineered bioweapon could circumvent such problems by separating the infection phase (which could be completely silent and airborne) from the eradication phase. The payload could be triggered deliberately at a later date when a certain secret artificial protein is released in the environment - and then produced in industrial quantities by infected hosts. Or maybe airdropped over areas that should be cleansed.
And that's just scratching the surface of what's conceptually possible. It could trigger specific ethnic characteristics or individuals, it could set up exotic cyber-hybrids like public key decryption in DNA for commands from its command and control. It could create side channels among infected hosts, for example by triggering minute anatomical modifications in the inner ear and the vocal centers, making them able to send and receive ultra- or infrasounds controlled by the mallware.
As a more subtle cyberattack, an infected individual could grow a whole parasitic subsystem that extracts select visual and auditory data and stores them in DNA memory for later broadcast.
Re: The life cycle of HIV in 3D [video]
#55As a technologist, I have mixed feelings when I see the fascinating details of life. On one hand, mastering this molecular machine would give us literally God-like powers: we could fabricate, grow or heal anything. We could solve all current problems, we could terraform planets using a few milligrams of DNA and literally redefine what it means to be human. On the other, I see the human body as a completely unsecured…
> power to kill every human on the planet. Truly God-like powers. You can't really design a perfect virus that will wipe out the human race, because anything you do to affect its properties will also affect its ability to spread. I'd be way more concerned about the destructive power of nuclear weapons, still numerous enough to destroy a very large part of humanity and our vital infrastructures.
Re: The life cycle of HIV in 3D [video]
#56Earlier quoted context omitted.
Ha, my thoughts were similar to yours but in the opposite direction: With such complicated machinery being involved in every part of micro biology, how can humans ever hope to cure anything? Everything down there is so complex, fast and intricate and we're stuck up here able to interact with it only in the most brute force and imprecise ways.
I think the general strategy to fight HIV is to try to disrupt one or two key events of the process. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Management_of_HIV/AIDS
Re: The life cycle of HIV in 3D [video]
#57The amazing part for me was that virus "code" automatically finds the unrelated host "code" in what is effectively an equivalent of space travel inside a host body, does copy and paste to insert itself somewhere in host code and everything just works! I can't think of any of our computing models that is capable of doing this and so robust at errors.
Re: The life cycle of HIV in 3D [video]
#58Earlier quoted context omitted.
> power to kill every human on the planet. Truly God-like powers. You can't really design a perfect virus that will wipe out the human race, because anything you do to affect its properties will also affect its ability to spread. I'd be way more concerned about the destructive power of nuclear weapons, still numerous enough to destroy a very large part of humanity and our vital infrastructures.
What would prevent the development of something like HIV that’s able to spread through the air like the flu?
think of it this way: every cool feature you add to a living thing has an overhead.
you want your little bacteria to have antibiotic resistance? fine.
but it'll need that much more energy to grow relative to the bacteria which don't have the added burden.
this means that unless there's the selective pressure of antibiotics in the environment, your little antibiotic resistant microbe won't stand a chance -- it's a fraction less efficient under normal conditions, so it's effectively out-competed when in the wild.
as far as massive adaptations like airborne spreading, that's not something that can just mutate overnight. HIV is fragile, so you'd need to engineer an entirely new viral envelope, or, more likely, an entirely new carrier particle that the virus can reconstruct on its own without impacting its infectivity. viruses like the flu have these adaptations by default. but once again, if you decide to turn the flu into HIV, it's going to be at a disadvantage in the wild.
not to say that it is impossible to make virions which are able to out-compete their wild-type cousins when infecting hosts in the real world. far from it. it's just not as easy to make it work as a quick look might find.
Re: The life cycle of HIV in 3D [video]
#59Question. How is that even knowing the lifecycle of HIV at this level of detail, there is not a cure for it?
One of the problems is that HIV stitches it's DNA into the cells DNA. The result is a latent infection reservoir that can last decades.
even when medicated -- for decades -- viral particles hang out safely in the body, often in the lymph nodes. as soon as the medication stops, they bounce back.
Re: The life cycle of HIV in 3D [video]
#60As a technologist, I have mixed feelings when I see the fascinating details of life. On one hand, mastering this molecular machine would give us literally God-like powers: we could fabricate, grow or heal anything. We could solve all current problems, we could terraform planets using a few milligrams of DNA and literally redefine what it means to be human. On the other, I see the human body as a completely unsecured…
Interestingly the Gene Regulatory Network (GRN) - the interaction of genes and proteins that control the prosess inside the cell is computationally very similar to recurrent neural network. Gene expression levels is controlled by proteins that are produced by active genes. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gene_regulatory_network Harnessing this mechanism directly for neural computation would be grand project.
Just because the GRN contains feedback loops with multiple influences doesn't mean it's suited to NN computation. The GRN is orders of magnitude more complex than computational NNs and it is orders of magnitude slower than signal transduction of axons.
I agree it will be awesome to be able to harness molecular machinery to "do stuff" for us. The "nanotechnology" in our bodies is way beyond any current manufactured nanotechnology.
We currently have only crude control of the cellular functionality -- think point a wind up toy in the direction we want or modify it by taping a flashlight to the top. We are pretty far from being able to use the manufacturing equipment to make cars instead of windup toys. (Not to mention the manufacturer is already making rockets)