51–60 of 348 posts
Doctor! It hurts when I do _this_!
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The operator of a vehicle is responsible for operating it. Somewhere between 7-10 iterations of the same dangerous failure mode, it's time to stop betting your life that the failure won't repeat. > Walter complained "7-10 times the car would swivel toward that same exact barrier during auto-pilot." This still doesn't diminish Tesla's obligation to make their autopilot system behave properly.
"The operator of a vehicle is responsible for operating it." But he wasn't operating it.
Would it make a difference if you learned that the driver knew there were problems with autopilot and was using it anyway?
One of the things you learn in flying is not to force it. If conditions are not safe. Just forget about it. It almost seems the same type of judgement needs to be made for auto-pilot. If your auto-pilot acts up at all. Just turn it off and don't use it till it's resolved. All you need is one incident to be dead, so if you get a chance to observe any abnormalities, consider it a blessing. Something that will also be g…
Good point, and it isn't just vehicles with auto-pilot perhaps all vehicles.
The 2017 and 2018 Chrysler Pacifica Minivan kept on randomly shutting off[0] and loosing all electrical power at freeway speeds. You had to put the vehicle back into park, on the freeway, to restart it. There are several stories of near death experiences trying to get to the shoulder. It was intermittent.
This is relevant because nobody could figure out why, even the manufacturer. They had to install custom self-powered diagnostic equipment in consumer's vehicles to even try and get enough data on it. Turns out that suddenly cutting power to the onboard computers doesn't make them very useful for diagnostic analysis, some dealers even acted like the problem didn't exist because the computer had no record.
They did ultimately get it fixed (replaced an engine management unit or similar) but it does go to show that modern vehicles are getting so complicated that even manufacturers are struggling to stay ahead of it. Tesla's autopilot and similar just takes that up another notch.
[0] https://www.autoblog.com/2017/11/21/chrysler-pacifica-owners...
One of the things you learn in flying is not to force it. If conditions are not safe. Just forget about it. It almost seems the same type of judgement needs to be made for auto-pilot. If your auto-pilot acts up at all. Just turn it off and don't use it till it's resolved. All you need is one incident to be dead, so if you get a chance to observe any abnormalities, consider it a blessing. Something that will also be g…
My only experience of automated driving is the feature where you can set a maximum speed. This is useful in the UK since average speed cameras are commonplace on the motorway network nowadays and it is easy for your concentration to lapse and drift over the current limit. The cameras are automated and there isn't much leeway.
However, the speed limits often change in range of 50, 60, 70 mph depending on local conditions and roadworks, so you can never just 'set and forget' you need to be alert all of the time since speed limits can change frequently.
It's going to be a long time before I trust a car to do this on its own without my supervision and, as regards going to sleep and letting the car do 'everything' on its own, I don't envisage being able to do this comfortably in my lifetime.
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True, but let's not blame the victim.
I honestly worried about that when writing the comment. The car should have avoided it (based on Tesla’s usual claims). But Tesla and everyone else says the owner is still ultimately responsible because AutoPilot isn’t a 100% situation. If my car did something funky like randomly accelerate or turn hard at a given intersection and the manufacturer refused to fix it I’d stop driving through there. Why push your luck?…
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The lesson here is that Tesla does not take complaints seriously and someone died as a result. It sounds just as likely to me that another person using autopilot would have had the same issue at that location.
It's too early to draw that conclusion. Note that the claims in the article are coming from the family and haven't been corroborated by Tesla yet. It's possible they are incorrect about aspects of the story they're telling for various reasons.
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I wonder how fast they replace crushed barriers.
The crash was at the 101 and 85 flyover for the carpool lane. Next to that lane there is a sign warning of upcoming construction closures... in fall 2017. Does that answer your question?
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I honestly worried about that when writing the comment. The car should have avoided it (based on Tesla’s usual claims). But Tesla and everyone else says the owner is still ultimately responsible because AutoPilot isn’t a 100% situation. If my car did something funky like randomly accelerate or turn hard at a given intersection and the manufacturer refused to fix it I’d stop driving through there. Why push your luck?…
We adapt to weird behavior all the time. I once found my brake pedal went right to the floor while driving. Then it fixed itself. I drove carefully after that but still kept using it. The other day my engine started revving up uncontrollably until I pulled over and turned it off. It's been fine since. I still drive it. Would you blame someone if their check engine light was on or the steering felt a bit wobbly?
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Depends where you live. I had no issues in Europe or Asia so far.
Even in Europe to get from A to B you need to switch trains super often. Like in France you almost always need to go to Paris first before going somewhere else because the network is so centralized around Paris.
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The operator of a vehicle is responsible for operating it. Somewhere between 7-10 iterations of the same dangerous failure mode, it's time to stop betting your life that the failure won't repeat. > Walter complained "7-10 times the car would swivel toward that same exact barrier during auto-pilot." This still doesn't diminish Tesla's obligation to make their autopilot system behave properly.
The lesson here is that Tesla does not take complaints seriously and someone died as a result. It sounds just as likely to me that another person using autopilot would have had the same issue at that location.
That may be what you extracted from this incident, but it's definitely not "the lesson".